In my humble opinion, a candidate does not need to come from within a political party, or be a party regular, or be "blessed" by the party because of their past work.

The purpose of a political party is not a country club to reward those insiders that promote it, by allowing them to run for office.

Too many times I've heard it said, "He/she deserves to be elected because of their past support of the party." BULL-FEATHERS!!

A local party should recruit the best and most qualified candidates from all walks of life and should not require their participation in said party to receive their support.

The Fayette County Republican Party has had this mentality for a number of years. They have thrown support behind their "own" rather than community leaders who would make excellent elected officials. In many cases, they failed.

Stop the "inbreeding" and open up to the wide assortment of qualified people available.

You've not had very good success lately with pushing "your own".

I have to disagree with you on a couple of points. One is that nobody is "for Smith". Jack may not have attracted a huge following in this blog arena, but there are plenty of people out there who are for him and are actively supporting him, all to Wells' dismay.

The second is your statement that Jack Smith has no "people". Your assumption that the votes he got were anti-Wells votes is false, at least in part. Jack has been president of the Chamber, Optimist Club and Rotary Club, widely active in many different community organizations and his church. It is my belief that Jack was supported by thousands of people who have known him over the years. Additionally I believe he drew many new votes in the short 5 weeks he actually had to campaign after income tax season was over.

I do agree that the "pool" of bloggers that blog here is not statistically large enough to be considered indicative of the entire county population, and I would add that the bloggers that come here come with an axe to grind and therefore the sample is not random. A statistical sample that is not random, ie, biased, is useless in making predictions of the larger population.

I would agree also that many of the posters here are doing it for amusement, without a thorough knowledge of all the issues and/or the politics involved. There are not enough posters here to much of an impact.

Which Rotary club not Peachtree City I have been a member since 1995? He has not been President of ours.

Jack has been Treasurer and President of the Fayetteville Rotary Club. He was also awarded Rotarian of the Year.

Maggie, I agree Jack does a great job for the Fayetteville Rotary Club. He may also have been Secretary, Vice President, and President elect, most members have to go through this process to become president....

With this Rotary pedigree there is no doubt he has done plenty for community service. As achieving Rotarian of the year I personally believe this to be a better accomplishment, due to the fact the whole club votes for this honor.

Didn't know there were others, than PTC! And nothing really happened much before 1995, anyway. Some people!!!!

There are many Rotary Clubs, Rotary is world wide, two just in Fayette County, one in PTC, and one in Fayetteville. So what does "Some people!!!" mean along with your point that nothing happened much before 1995?

If you did not know there were other Rotary clubs other that Peachtree City do not Blog about it.

Dear Tonto,

I stand corrected as to those comments. Jack Smith apparently does have a base of support, so I would agree with you on those comments. Being the President of the those organizations are worthy of many supporters. However, this election was more about an Anti-Dunn/Wells Pro-Sheriff sentiment than it was about being "for" any candidate. Look at Sam Chapman's votes. As they say, even Mickey Mouse would get votes in an election.

However, I still stand by my earlier comments that its gonna be very hard to ride the negative to a majority of votes, when the incumbent had more than 45% during the first election. If Jack wants to get elected, he better be knocking on doors.

If one looks at the precinct by precinct voting Wells did best in places like PTC and she didn't do well in Brooks etc. The question is, will Brooks and the other areas of the county come out in support of Jack, or will then shrug their shoulders and feel good about having taken down Dunn, and decide to call it a day.

Thats the million dollar question. I think Wells will win merely because of the numbers, nothing more.

I will say that I spoke to Jack and he was pleasant and amenable. He didn't seem to know about the local party and of course I invited him to join our party and to join our activities whether he gets elected or not, but he has not chosen to join the local party as of this date. In fact, he's not even on our email or phone tree list, and that costs nothing to join.

I guess he has been pretty busy in those other very laudable organizations, but we could use the help.

For these blogs to carry no influence to speak of, you are indeed doing your pro-Linda campaigning.

If Linda were doing a good job, without reservation, she would have carried the primary handily.

She did not. Why? Because of her record.

So, people look to see who is now the best candidate for the commission. That is positve voting for Smith, negative voting for Wells.

Not being active in the local party is not even a consideration in my book, as an Independent. In fact, I applaud it.

Since when did active equal competent?

Kick out both parties and let everyone run on their own merits, not party affiliations.

I am totally disgusted with those who say McCain has 'earned' the right to be the Republican presidential nomination because he is 'due' because of his party seniority.

Look at what happened with Bob Dole and that garbage thinking.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

I do agree that the "pool" of bloggers that blog here is not statistically large enough to be considered indicative of the entire county population,

That is incomplete data consideration. You are forgetting the lurkers, meaning those who read rarely post, or may never register.

That jumps the numbers into the thousands.

I have seen, on my site, where maybe only a hundred and some logged in for the whole month, that the total unique visitors would be 40,000 plus while the logins were minimal.

Don't make the mistake of only looking for login numbers.

and I would add that the bloggers that come here come with an Axe to grind and therefore the sample is not random.

Is an interesting in discussing issues an ax to grind?

A statistical sample that is not random, ie, biased, is useless in making predictions of the larger population.

Who is making predictions? My statement was there is influence. Nothing more.

I would agree also that many of the posters here are doing it for amusement, without a thorough knowledge of all the issues and/or the politics involved. There are not enough posters here to much of an impact.

Always have the fun posters.

But, again, you error greatly if you only look at the numbers who login. The claims, discussion, facts and questions posted most assuredly impact the lurkers.

Then that influences discussions with others.

As in you taking issue with Richard on Jack having people for him, instead of being an anti-Wells vote.

That impacts the lurkers.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

You make number two that has come on to disagree. Which, in and of itself, backs what I said.

Your assumption blog or forum must be huge and national in scale, to be meaningful, is not well thought out.

Every hear, "All politics are local?"

Or is it you do not find the regular folk of Fayette County sophisticated and educated enough to use, understand and glean information for such a source?

However, this little website is just an entertainment tool and nothing more.

This declaration was based upon what facts? Your perceptions?

Blogs and forums, large and small, have impact. I know from experience.

So, let me see. This is a forum on a Fayette County newspaper that is the one and only for Fayette. Therefore, in Fayette County elections it carries no meaning or power?

Really?

My rants and ravings? No fact every presented? No pertinent questions every asked? No refutations of meaning?

Then why did Peter, Greg and Janet feel compelled to post here, more than once?

The fact you are on posting means it carried on impact upon you. It made you think.

In all your lawyer speak, you backed Dunn, and lost. You back Wells, are trying to discredit a source of opposition by painting a picture of the posters all being ranting and raving people of no consequence.

Plus, trying to paint Smith as dangerous because he is unknown to you.

Nice try. But I see right through you.

Nope. I don't say this in lawyer speak. But my point gets through. Be it ranting and raving or just strongly believed in.

Bottom line here is you back Wells and you fear this forum has an impact on the election. Otherwise, you would have laughed and walked away. Even more so you would never have made political posts, past tense, trying to enhance Dunn.

Please. You may be a lawyer, but some of us, here, are not fools, swallowing your attempted semantical diversions and game playing.

Some of us are even Web Masters and other things, regarding blog and forum sites, and have been so for years. And know the impact they have.

This kind of effort is exactly what many of us want to get away from in politics. It is a turn off. Big time.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

Even the White House is very aware of the power of blogs and forums.

They know they carry impact.

Impact a hundred. Those impact others. And so on.

Nope, the forums do not have to impact everyone directly to impact in the finality.

Yes, there was some real nonsense said. But there were also a lot of facts intermingled.

And emotion? What is wrong with that? We are suppose to be like Dukakis?

Right here, you read my statement. It stimulated thought. You felt the need to respond. I am, in kind responding.

Called dialogue. The exchange of ideas. Ideas change people.

Your own efforts here prove my point that forums have power.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

So when I respond to your premises that this site doesn't have any real effect, then you use my own reply to prove me wrong....

But then again, if in fact, these blogs are effective at proving vital points of interest to the masses, then my actual post has done that as well and therefore, my premise that this newspaper blog does little if any in effecting the elections is proof unto itself, since I said it on a blog.

So which is it? Is this blog decidely effecting the elections, which is proven because I am responding to it, or does this blog have no effect because my blog says it doesn't?

All in all, I read these blogs from time to time, but I am on the internet throughout the day. I run my own website with 523 other attorneys, so I have to be, or I'd never get caught up.

But I sincerely doubt that most of the 11,600 Republican voters tend to surf the web as much as I, Git Real, better known as ch, or PTC GUY. Actually, I hope that most of the voters have a life outside of being on the net all day.

So when I respond to your premises that this site doesn't have any real effect, then you use my own reply to prove me wrong....

Yep. A person who believes what they have declared meaningless for an election does not have to carry on trying to prove it is meaningless.

They simply believe it is meaningless and allow it to continue to be meaningless.

Thus to continue the argument means it is not meaningless to them.

Simple principles of logic.

But then again, if in fact, these blogs are effective at proving vital points of interest to the masses, then my actual post has done that as well and therefore, my premise that this newspaper blog does little if any in effecting the elections is proof unto itself, since I said it on a blog.

Oh please. Take a look at your logic statement.

If blogs are effective, then your post was effective in proving the point they are ineffective.

Statement false. A contradictory statement that denies its own premise. An illogical statement from the start.

Why? Because if your point is effective, then it denies blogs are ineffective, thus proves my point.

But this a false statement, in logic, so it is disproven without any discussion.

It ranks right there with the old:
If God can do anything, can he create a rock to big for him to move.

It is false because it is an invalid statement to begin with. The one clause precludes the conclusion.

This was a bad effort at trying to prove your intellectual superiority. Arguments like this are a dime a dozen in theology.

All in all, I read these blogs from time to time, but I am on the internet throughout the day. I run my own website with 523 other attorneys, so I have to be, or I'd never get caught up.

Then you should understand the power of a blog or forum.

But I sincerely doubt that most of the 11,600 Republican voters tend to surf the web as much as I, Git Real, better known as ch, or PTC GUY.

True, but stated to prove a false claim. That being one has to read the posts for themselves to be influenced. It dismisses information spread in either a arithmatic or exponential manner from those who do read.

Actually, I hope that most of the voters have a life outside of being on the net all day.

I know of no one that does not do so.

But again, you are trying to build a false proof. One does not have to be on the forum all day to be impacted by it. It does not take all day to read.

No. Wells is being impacted. As Dunn was.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

I'll give you two to one odds on the upcoming election that the effect of these blogs has little to do with the outcome. I will categorically state, here and now, that the Polling done on this site, reflects an entirely different electorate than what the real polls will eventually show.

If your premise is right, then Linda should lose very dramatically, or if I am correct, then only a few, lonely and vocal few, such as myself, frequent this site. And those opinions expressed on this site has little if any "effect" on the outcome.

Deal?

Wells winning or loosing does not reflect how much impact the forums here hold.

You have no idea that, if she wins, that she would have not won the primary outright, but didn't, because of here.

Your offer, here, has no bearing on the point I opened this blog with.

As for the polling here, it is throw away. People can vote multiple times. You don't even have to login to vote.

There are way too many factors to include, such as those who will not vote again because they voted for state level, schools and so on.

My statement is simply that blogs and forums have impact. And issues and points have been raised that do put a crimp in the Good Ole Boy system of how elections go.

Look at my opener. I stated not to get me wrong. That this was but one factor among many.

I am neither stupid nor a daydreamer. But I am voting for Smith.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

I think you will find that I stated here that the poll on the Citizen Online has no credibility. It actually has about as much credibility as the poll you ran a couple of years ago on your Repbulican Party page that showed the late Charlie Mask the leader by a landslide in a previous commission race. So leave me out of it.

Furthermore if you feel we are so damned ignorant and irrelevant then leave us the heck alone. I actually like you better when you operate off of your other pen name. Highgreen that is.

I just figured out why trial lawyers wear ties. I can see you need it to keep the f*reskin out of your eyes.

away with calling Hobbs Richard head.

His comments do portray us as local yokels incapable of thinking for ourselves and discussing issues.

I hope muddle gets a look at his logic statements and rips them apart as flawed. He has a better command of the logic class lingo than I do.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

I don't consider you Yokels, or of incapable of thinking. Merely because I might disagree with the overall effect that this website has with its users and with its lurkers, doesn't mean I've called you juvenile names.

The point is that although this website generates alot of interest from many surfers, such as myself, and from many lurkers, I strongly suspect that the opinions expressed by anonymous writers tends not to weld much influence over the voters.

To be quite frank, if the bantering that goes back and forth on this site were to be influential on the electorate, I'd be embarrassed for the quality of the average voter. Lets hope they have more sence then to take our opinions as those of substance rather than in investigating and forming their own opinions upon facts rather than the emotionally charged hyperboles of this blog, which cast unsubstantiated allegations out against any and every candidate without end.

So, my apologizes for even infering you are a yokel. Come to think of it, I don't even know what a yokel is, so maybe "I is one!"

If everyone here talked like a lawyer this place would die.

Let's face it. Jay Leno or Arlen Specter. Jay Leno makes better political points than the ever so uptight lefty lawyer Arlen does and he's a whold lot more entertaing too. So....you're stuck with us. Unless of course Cal tires of us.

We could always do a poll. How about it guys. Cal might play.

You have to understand that Hobbs bleeds Republican and it's upsetting to him and the other hacks that they have lost control, credibility, and influence in these races and with the Conservative voting base.

PTC Guy...you may be a local yokel but you are a darn good one. As for me I am proud to be a Fayette County Local Yokel. That means I am a property owner that pays taxes, employs many people, works hard in the community, helps others, and cares about this county deeply. The problem with lawyer boy is that deep down inside he is intimidated and frustrated that we don't buy into his party line like the rest of the Fayette County Republican hacks that kiss his keister all the time.

I will credit him for getting the Fair Tax on the ballot. Good job on that one Richard.

Vote Jack Smith. A virtual nobody to Richard Hobbs but a somebody to us little people.

ch...hmmmm

I would rather wisdom framed in humor than foolishness framed in eloquence. The measure of a person is their meaning, since a fool can sound great, but still be a fool.

And that was a generic statement, not one aimed at Richard.

I, as well, extend my appreciation for getting the Fair Tax on the ballot. Time to get something rolling.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

Dear Git Real,

This is what I refer to when I say that this community blog is of little significance when only juvenile comments are made.

To call me a hack over 'losing control' of the party is ludicrious, because you say you know me personally, and anyone who knows me, knows I have no interest at all in that sort of thing. I do, however, bleed Republican, or really conservative. I believe in the principles of our party, even if our candidates do not follow those principles. I have no control issues, unless you consider my disdain for candidates who have NEVER, EVER, been involved in any Republican grassroots organization at all, and then come along and expect the party to bow down and worship them because they have announced their candidacy as a Republican.

This also infuriates me when the candidate is running for an office for which he knows nothing. For which he has not consistently excercised his right to vote, and for which when he has, he as voted Democratic. a.k.a. Horgan.

Or for those Candidates with no common sense but only money and a mouth, and think they can buy an election by riding the coattails of others who happen to have true supporters. a.k.a. Chapman.

I think you, Git Real, ought to come back to the Party and try and make a difference at the grassroots level and actually volunteer in doing work. Talk is cheap and type written words even cheaper.

We have had many if not most of those that work with us that have more interest in padding their resumes, rather than in helping to have a viable organization for which to grow a strong base of qualified candidates. Egos are always tripping over egos. In fact, some have merely come to the party and done nothing but complain incessantly about this or that and contribute nothing of a positive nature to our goals. Even complaining about silly emails that are sent out...on more than one occaision.

And finally, I don't consider you "netmasters" as the little people. But I also don't consider you to know the pulse of the masses either. Neither do I consider myself in tune with the voters. I weld no power of influence other than perhaps with a very few, and they usually bark at me when its time for dinner or when they want to go outside.

So, please don't lay this silly diatribe of "control jibes" over me and the work I do for the party. My contributions are insignificant but they are contributions none the less. I wish you'd come back to the party and help make it better so that we truly would only have strong and qualified republicans running for office. Besides, I'd love nothing better than to blend back into the flowers on the wall and only come out when I absolutely have to.

Come on back, Git Real.....errr ch, the Party needs workers not egos. I'm serious, I'd love to have you and a few of your friends come back to the party and help us do the work of getting good candidates elected.

How can you tell the difference anymore? Is it fiscal responsibility? Is it peace? Is it spying on Americans? Is it getting rich while in office? Is it using religion to run? Is it lying? Is it pretension? All sound the same to me. Be independent, then vote for the party who has the best candidate, not some jackass just because. (Bush).

I spent thirty minutes typing a detailed reply to your letter. I dumped it. I determined that I do not need to defend myself to you and if I tried to explain it to you I'd say some things that I would rather not get into at this point. Perhaps you and I have quite a bit in common but history has proved to me that personal agendas trump Conservative values and efforts in the Fayette County party. It was also not my desire to dredge up old crap and get into a peeing match with you on it as you were no where near the scene for many years.

I cannot return to a place where people will tell you what you want to hear while pretending they are your best friends. I can no longer tolerate phonies that will stand there...peeing on my feet...while trying to convince me that it is raining.

Show me a party that will take a Lynn Westmoreland behind closed doors and tell him what a freaking embarrassment he is to the party and to the Conservative movement and I'll pay attention. Show me a party that will truly root out the RINO's and I'll stand beside you. Show me a party that truly believes in fiscal Conservatism and I'll fight and roll in the mud with em.

But all I see is a bunch of wine and cheese party seekers looking for accalades from the clown section. Sorry man. Respectfully...been there and done that.

Richard, If you are truly the Conservative you claim to be then I applaud you. But it's truly difficult for most of us to tell because the phonies are and have been good actors and so prevelant in the Fayette County Republican Party and beyond.

If you think this is long winded the one I deleted was 10 times this long. ch huh? Think so? Perhaps I'm brighter than that. Or not?

Might have been a good thing that you did delete what you wrote. I find the internet, emails, and blogging to be a very delicate medium. In days past, we'd write snail mail and often think and re-think our thoughts through, having read and re-read the letter before it went into the mailbox. Today, we type off a quick retort and hit send, and then its gone, perhaps sooner than we thought.

I understand your grips about the party. I've rarely found any organization or group that didn't have the same complaints that you have shared with us. Personalities take over and nothing seems to get done. So I'm with you on that. But I'm not at that stage yet, to where I can just throw up my hands and walk away, trust me, I'd love to, but then I stop and remember why I do what I do and just keep keeping on.

A dear friend of mine, Guy Davis was the candidate for Governor in 86. He was bamboozled by Joe Frank who orchestrated a deal with our Republican leadership. Its a sad story of how we often forget why we are doing what we are doing. Nonetheless, as dumbfounded as I find myself, I still have to keep hoping and praying that the conservatives will again win out. I hate to say it, but maybe just maybe if we lose the house or senate, that maybe we will learn a lesson from it. By the way, Guy and his lovely wife came to our recent event for no other reason than to say thanks to the citizens of Fayette for thier support some 20 years ago. You don't find 'em much more loyal than that. Heart of gold.

However, as hard as it is to continue to work within this very imperfect organization, I find that being bitter and upset isn't the answer. I could sit back and bitch and laugh when others fall on their face because of thier ignorance or incompetence, but then again, thats not why I do the work that I do. I suck it up and remember that I'm working for a better party, a more conservative party, that no matter how long or hard I work, it will never reach the goals that I have set for it.

So I guess I could just walk away, that would be the easy road, and trust me, I would love to. But I'd rather have others take the reigns away from me who might have more energy and vigor. Who will help move this party back to a true conservative/Goldwater/Reagan Party? I don't know, but I'm willing to help.

Don't mean to sound so sancramonious. I'm really not that particularly pious. But I have to work for something. Standing around and kicking the dirt is just plain boring.

So, knock the chip off your shoulder, it weighs heavy, and then take a deep breath and come on back to help. Sure, we still have our wine and cheese crowds, and sure we will have disagreements on texas hold'em tournaments and emails about terrorists, etc., but the ultimate goal is not to promote oneself but to help our party.

Sides its more fun than debating on an online forum with people that you might not associate with if you really knew who they were.

;>)

Thanks for the perspective. Can't talk much now. But I'm not carrying around a chip on my shoulder so don't fret for me on that one. I just call it like I see it (bluntly I guess you could say) and work in a different arena where I know my efforts will not be wasted on RINO and meaningless political efforts. Later.

You will get the point and go Independent.

Many folk have. That is why it is the largest voting block now.

For me, I see a Republican Party that is pretty much the Democratic Party of my youth.

I have seen nothing but slide and increased arrogance for 40 years.

40 years ago the idea of so many independents would have been laughed at.

It isn't giving up. It is withdrawing verbal, work and financial support to deliver a message.

Truly, having analysed it through, we need a 3rd party that is relevant.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

Rather than post before yours, GR, I will reply to Richard after.

Richard. I am an Independent not because I stand for nothing, but because I do.

I cannot support the Democratic Party because I am a Biblical conservative. Meaning I have no place in my life for supporting their socially liberal views.

I cannot support the Republican Party because I am a Biblical conservative and have no place iin my life for a party that supports big business and policy decisions that willing destroy the little guy, embrace extremist liberals into the party, for no other reason than they can get elected, and worship winning and money over people.

The Repuplicans are, in example, sending billions to aid those who will not change their life style and have rampant AIDS.

Why are they being sent the money? Because they are black and other countries are pressuing the US.

We are giving money to the Palestinian government. What a fool's waste of money there.

We have a party trying to give Amnesty to illegals. Not to mention free medical and everything else, while the bring in drugs, crime and are destroying our economy.

Bush and his group have done nothing. Why should I belong to a party that does that?

Please don't try to tell me they are working on it. Where have they been for years prior to upcoming elections?

I want to see people running that stand for and mean something. Both parties stand for and mean nothing.

A good, conservative, 3rd party could replace the Democrats and put the Republicans in a big hurt.

I am saying the Republican Party is too entrenched in its ways. It cannot be fixed.

Yes, I vote heavily against the Democrats. I want to actually vote for someone for a change.

But sure not with the character of Dunn, Wells and Peter.

Time for a change. A big one.

I have seen too many good people hurt by BOTH parties. The average Joe is disponsable goods for their agendas.

And I don't like, in example, Mexico making our people disposable for them.

Something has to give, our country is falling apart around us.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

There is no need to try this. It won't work. Also, a third or fourth or fifth party only fractionalizes us further. Here is what you do: when the republicans and the democrats pick their man, vote for the best one, whomever he is. Even Kerry would have been much better than Bush. It is shere stupidity to vote party, regardless

That lying, back stabbing jerk.

I don't vote for traitors.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

Have you ever thought of being a Libertarian? They are usually people like you that can't support the Dems or Reps. I finally became one after Bush knowingly signed the unconstitutional McCain-Feingold "incumbency protection law" and pushed the Medicare Prescription Drug bill - the biggest entitlement in our history. If you wnat to read a good book on what it means to be a Libertarian read Mary Ruwart's Healing Our World In an Age of Aggression (you can download the older version Healing Our World The Other Piece of the Puzzle from her website : http://www.ruwart.com/Healing/ ) It is a fascinating book and changed my perspective on so many things governmnet related.

But the idea of a 'Buyer Beware' and 'Anything Goes' party is not for me.

It goes way too far.

It is ultra fiscal withdrawal while being exremist on liberal social views.

Too extreme. It will never become a viable party.

But thanks for the thought.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

I'm not gonna debate religion with you. Thats another point all to itself. I've debated it with many and I don't think this topic or forum would do to welcome a full fledged debate on why the Democrats or Republicans are not "christian" enough for you.

I will say this, your position is neither hot nor cold, it is lukewarm.

Put that in your Bible's lexicon and dictionary and tell me what it says about that.

Then read the passage that explains that the greatest of all things is love, and that although you may very well be the only person that "gets" it when it comes to understanding God and how he communicates with us with a book written 2000 years ago, and codified by some politicians some 300-400 years later, that you might want to take it down a notch when you judge us heathern to hells fire.

I mean, if your right, then I'm gonna burn, shouldn't that be enough satisfaction for you and God to know that, instead of having to torment me down here on earth with how wrong I and the Repubican party is?

I'm not gonna debate religion with you. Thats another point all to itself. I've debated it with many and I don't think this topic or forum would do to welcome a full fledged debate on why the Democrats or Republicans are not "christian" enough for you.

You miss the point and protest too much.

I am totally opposes to a theocracy.

The Democratic and Republican parties are not moral enough for me. A distinction you many not understand.

I will say this, your position is neither hot nor cold, it is lukewarm.

Boy, you are wrong. I am boiling hot on my opposition to these liars and con artists.

Bush is one of the worst presidents we have ever had. Clinton even worse than that.

They have, generically speaking, abandoned the people they are suppose to represent, and have adopted a political stance that is based on how to get elected.

You and your compromise position, phrased as grass roots movement, is the lukewarm position for change.

You think this is anything new? Been hearing it for decades.

Maybe with time you will give up the delusion you can change them.

Put that in your Bible's lexicon and dictionary and tell me what it says about that.

It says you don't know what you are talking about. My position is anything but wishy washy.

Your position is wishy washy. Your going to be part of the change to what you don't like about. But being part of means you have to back what is while trying to change it.

You are defeating yourself by giving them money, time and effort. They take that for what they can use, for themselves, and disregard the rest.

Been there, in such things, and learned all you do is get used. Then when you take a stand, you get pushed aside.

Then read the passage that explains that the greatest of all things is love,

And love corrects, teaches, chastises, rebukes and so on, to get people out of error.

Don't go where you cannot stand up in the debate.

Want to debate that, go where appropriate. Got to the place in my profile.

But, you won't. You are just grandstanding, here.

and that although you may very well be the only person that "gets" it when it comes to understanding God and how he communicates with us with a book written 2000 years ago, and codified by some politicians some 300-400 years later, that you might want to take it down a notch when you judge us heathern to hells fire.

Man, you so much don't get it. And so much despise the Bible.

You just hit so many buttons, I have heard over the years, I know exactly where you are coming from already. Called experience.

No. I am not the only one here that gets it. But I am one of the few that can actually frame the words to stand up against people like you.

I mean, if your right, then I'm gonna burn, shouldn't that be enough satisfaction for you and God to know that, instead of having to torment me down here on earth with how wrong I and the Repubican party is?

There is no satisfaction in anyone burning. But they do bring it on themselves.

You have shown your arrogance, superiority and party loyalty. Exactly what I find repulsive in both Parties.

Party before fellow man, God and right and wrong. All shades of gray based on what is 'good' for the party.

To change the party, you have to have a foundation guiding you, in regards to what you want to change it to.

When every little grass roots guy, like you, has a personally formulated vision, of what the party should be, you get no where. Because all you little guys are bickering among yourselves as to what the goal is.

The big boys use that. They work you, for them, until you wise up and start demanding things. Then you are history.

At least I have a simple but solid foundation to guide me, on politics. One that is not fluid and changeable, day to day, in the political winds of power and money.

As long as power and money guide the parties, they are going to be worthless in the main.

Blaze away. Tell me how the Republican Party loves the little guy, while exporting our jobs, buying votes by letting illegals and so on. Tell me how I don't understand economics.

Then tell me who is going to buy all the more expensive products when everyone is getting paid minimum wage. That is, those who can find work.

All the hype on health care. But did you know the Republicans passed a law that allows people with diseases, such as diabetes, high blood pressure, and so on, to be dumped by insurance companies? Even if the diabetic is type 2 with diet control, no pills?

The Republicans back big business over the little guy every time.

Why do you think more incidents, such as the 'onion odor,' are happening?

Oooops. I am ranting and raving.

Think about it. You may gain some wisdom beyond your years.

And don't plead your legal knowledge as wisdom. Don't even go there.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.

I am absolutely not a Fundamentalist or Evangelical by the secular jargon and terminology of the day.

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Keeping it real and to the core of the issue, not the peripherals.