In election 2008, don’t forget Angry White Man

Shadow08's picture

[Editor's note: This opinion piece by Gary Hubbell was originally published in Aspen Times Weekly, which can be viewed here.]

There is a great amount of interest in this year’s presidential elections, as everybody seems to recognize that our next president has to be a lot better than George Bush. The Democrats are riding high with two groundbreaking candidates — a woman and an African-American — while the conservative Republicans are in a quandary about their party’s nod to a quasi-liberal maverick, John McCain.

Each candidate is carefully pandering to a smorgasbord of special-interest groups, ranging from gay, lesbian and transgender people to children of illegal immigrants to working mothers to evangelical Christians.

There is one group no one has recognized, and it is the group that will decide the election: the Angry White Man. The Angry White Man comes from all economic backgrounds, from dirt-poor to filthy rich. He represents all geographic areas in America, from urban sophisticate to rural redneck, deep South to mountain West, left Coast to Eastern Seaboard.

His common traits are that he isn’t looking for anything from anyone — just the promise to be able to make his own way on a level playing field. In many cases, he is an independent businessman and employs several people. He pays more than his share of taxes and works hard.

The victimhood syndrome buzzwords — “disenfranchised,” “marginalized” and “voiceless” — don’t resonate with him. “Press ‘one’ for English” is a curse-word to him. He’s used to picking up the tab, whether it’s the company Christmas party, three sets of braces, three college educations or a beautiful wedding.

He believes the Constitution is to be interpreted literally, not as a “living document” open to the whims and vagaries of a panel of judges who have never worked an honest day in their lives.

The Angry White Man owns firearms, and he’s willing to pick up a gun to defend his home and his country. He is willing to lay down his life to defend the freedom and safety of others, and the thought of killing someone who needs killing really doesn’t bother him.

The Angry White Man is not a metrosexual, a homosexual or a victim. Nobody like him drowned in Hurricane Katrina — he got his people together and got the hell out, then went back in to rescue those too helpless and stupid to help themselves, often as a police officer, a National Guard soldier or a volunteer firefighter.

His last name and religion don’t matter. His background might be Italian, English, Polish, German, Slavic, Irish, or Russian, and he might have Cherokee, Mexican, or Puerto Rican mixed in, but he considers himself a white American.

He’s a man’s man, the kind of guy who likes to play poker, watch football, hunt white-tailed deer, call turkeys, play golf, spend a few bucks at a strip club once in a blue moon, change his own oil and build things. He coaches baseball, soccer and football teams and doesn’t ask for a penny. He’s the kind of guy who can put an addition on his house with a couple of friends, drill an oil well, weld a new bumper for his truck, design a factory and publish books. He can fill a train with 100,000 tons of coal and get it to the power plant on time so that you keep the lights on and never know what it took to flip that light switch.

Women either love him or hate him, but they know he’s a man, not a dishrag. If they’re looking for someone to walk all over, they’ve got the wrong guy. He stands up straight, opens doors for women and says “Yes, sir” and “No, ma’am.”

He might be a Republican and he might be a Democrat; he might be a Libertarian or a Green. He knows that his wife is more emotional than rational, and he guides the family in a rational manner.

He’s not a racist, but he is annoyed and disappointed when people of certain backgrounds exhibit behavior that typifies the worst stereotypes of their race. He’s willing to give everybody a fair chance if they work hard, play by the rules and learn English.

Most important, the Angry White Man is pissed off. When his job site becomes flooded with illegal workers who don’t pay taxes and his wages drop like a stone, he gets righteously angry. When his job gets shipped overseas, and he has to speak to some incomprehensible idiot in India for tech support, he simmers. When Al Sharpton comes on TV, leading some rally for reparations for slavery or some such nonsense, he bites his tongue and he remembers. When a child gets charged with carrying a concealed weapon for mistakenly bringing a penknife to school, he takes note of who the local idiots are in education and law enforcement.

He also votes, and the Angry White Man loathes Hillary Clinton. Her voice reminds him of a shovel scraping a rock. He recoils at the mere sight of her on television. Her very image disgusts him, and he cannot fathom why anyone would want her as their leader. It’s not that she is a woman. It’s that she is who she is. It’s the liberal victim groups she panders to, the “poor me” attitude that she represents, her inability to give a straight answer to an honest question, his tax dollars that she wants to give to people who refuse to do anything for themselves.

There are many millions of Angry White Men. Four million Angry White Men are members of the National Rifle Association, and all of them will vote against Hillary Clinton, just as the great majority of them voted for George Bush.

He hopes that she will be the Democratic nominee for president in 2008, and he will make sure that she gets beaten like a drum.

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Submitted by summonkey on Sun, 02/24/2008 - 12:14pm.

Ok this is not cool. I emailed this article to a few friends. It somehow got at two days later the operation manager calls me it to tell me that I am fired. There was no check waiting for me to papers to sighed. Just hand over my security badge and escorted out after I clean my desk out. I worked for Us bank now for 1.5 years and was just promoted. If you feel this is wrong to do please send your emails to my old boss. I would love to show her how many Americans feel this was. Her email addy is heather.friend@usbank.com If you want to you can email me summonkey21@hotamil.com

TinCan's picture
Submitted by TinCan on Sun, 02/24/2008 - 1:38pm.

Did you happen to be doing this web cruising and forwarding at "work"? Could explain a lot. If so I could e-mail and compliment your boss.


ImJustSaying's picture
Submitted by ImJustSaying on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:24am.

It is a pity that you have misquoted the author of this dissertation. No wait...you never acknowledged the author. This is actually titled "Angry American". Shadow08 has substituted "white man" for the word "American" through out, the effect of which polorizes instead of unifies. A pity indeed.


Submitted by thebeaver on Sun, 02/24/2008 - 1:53pm.

In election 2008, don’t forget Angry White Man

----------------------------------------------
Barack Obama is a human featherball -- a slick, smiling, substance-free empty suit who excites gullible dimwits by repeating the words “change,” “unity,” and “hope” over and over --

Locke's picture
Submitted by Locke on Sun, 02/24/2008 - 1:58pm.

If you think Obama is a featherball, why did you change your tagline to express how much he excites you?


TruthSleuth1958's picture
Submitted by TruthSleuth1958 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 1:17pm.

I don't suppose it matters to you, but you are WRONG

As is pointed out by the editor, the original post is:
In election 2008, don’t forget Angry White Man
Gary Hubbell
February 9, 2008

So your assertion that "This is actually titled "Angry American"." is incorrect.

You can click on the link provided by the editor, preceding the cut and paste by Shadow08, located above for the article.

Sniffles05 The Plagiarizer in Chief
Sniffles05:Jeffc calls for your explanation and apology.


TruthSleuth1958's picture
Submitted by TruthSleuth1958 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 11:03am.

Do you want him to quote like this:

Michelle Obama: "For the First Time in My Adult Lifetime, I'm Really Proud of My Country"

or do you prefer he quote like this:

“I am proud of my country,” and “I don’t know if you heard those words earlier … but I am very proud of my country.”

Cindy McCain


Shadow08's picture
Submitted by Shadow08 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:33am.

I never claimed it as original work product, and I checked, the link was put in the original posting, (Aspen) but I don't know why its not showing. I wouldn't want to use anothers words my be thought of as a Muslim Presidential Canidate. Rock on Hussian, no one else is going to stick up for us! I don't want to unify, someone needs to say it! OBTW stick to baking Gramps!


TruthSleuth1958's picture
Submitted by TruthSleuth1958 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 11:15am.

If you look at the attacks on Obama by Hillary (Larry et. al) and his attacks on Bush and McCain you will see that liberals attack people personally when they lack character and cannot argue content.

Our Daily Kos plagiarizer, Sniffles05, is the best evidence of that.

Consider any personal attacks by him/her (and there will be many) by the angry liberals on this site as a sheer lack of inability to use knowledge or a fact based argument. It really comes down to a feeble attempt to detract and deter.

Keep up the good work and blog away at your thoughts and any interested posts you hope to promote. That, after all, is the reason we have blogs.

Just try to keep it civil and rise above the personal attacks you will be exposed to.


sniffles5's picture
Submitted by sniffles5 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 11:17am.

Maybe it's that we don't want to play by your rules, always being made to answer any and all sleazy baseless charges that serial liars like you foist upon us.


TruthSleuth1958's picture
Submitted by TruthSleuth1958 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 11:25am.

Thanks for the evidence.

Here is more : http://www.thecitizen.com/~citizen0/node/25229

And this:

"Sniffles5" wrote to Git on Mon., 02/04/2008:

You list a bunch of unsavory characters;

then you assign them to me and in a state of high dudgeon.

The argument borders on a parataxic distortion and seems to be your standard technique against me.

How very...Conneresque!

Which guy, git?

____________________________

On the previous Sat., 02/02/2008, Jeffc wrote to me:

First you list a bunch of, at the very least, rude, crude and inappropriate behaviors exhibited by fringe elements in society;

then you assign them to me and in a state of high dungeon.

The argument borders on a parataxic distortion and seems to be your standard technique against me.

Well Denise

Can anyone shed more light on this? Is it true that several bloggers here are the same person with multiple screen names? How does this happen?

Insight is welcome.

And this:
______________________________________________________
Yes TruthSleuth
Jeffc's picture
Submitted by Jeffc on Thu, 02/14/2008 - 10:14am.

Frankly, I think Sniffles owes me/us an explanation. The original post made Saturday under JeffC is mine.

I assure you that I am not him/her.


Git Real's picture
Submitted by Git Real on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 5:52pm.

And the truth of his hypocrisies have been exposed. It seems to be the only time he is either ashamed to show his and fess up. The rest of us would apologize when being caught in such a shameful position. Smiling

________

"Be not afraid; for behold I bring you good tidings of great joy which shall be to all the people: for there is born to you this day in the city of Chicago a Savior, who is Barack the Democrat


Submitted by USArmybrat on Tue, 02/19/2008 - 11:32pm.

Except maybe for that comment about more emotional than rational!

TonyF's picture
Submitted by TonyF on Fri, 02/15/2008 - 6:47am.

Well said, my sentiments exactly, Shadow(I'll forgive the vending machine BS).

O wad some Power the giftie gie us,To see oursels as ithers see us!
(R. Burns)
If we could see ourselves as others see us, we would vanish on the spot.
(E. M. Cioran)


AF A-10's picture
Submitted by AF A-10 on Thu, 02/14/2008 - 11:24pm.

"He believes the Constitution is to be interpreted literally, not as a “living document” open to the whims and vagaries of a panel of judges who have never worked an honest day in their lives."

-Translation: Angry white men will not support a marriage amendment, flag amendment, or sanctity of life amendment to that timeless document.

I'll save a bunch of time and skip right to the good part:

"There are many millions of Angry White Men. Four million Angry White Men are members of the National Rifle Association, and all of them will vote against Hillary Clinton, just as the great majority of them voted for George Bush."

Yes, many of you brilliant "I think I'm more of a manly man than I can ever really be" types surely did vote for GWB; twice! How's that work out for you? No other president could lay the ground work that has caused twice as many people to vote in democratic primaries than republican. This so loathed Hillary Clinton has motivated twice as many people to vote for her than have voted for the leading (but loathed by his own) republican counterpart. And you no what is COUNTERING and CANCELING your message of hate and anger (hate of Hillary and anger at the ever warming world)? HOPE! You are being muted by giddy, smiling, enthusiastic people like me! People who shoot really really big guns sometimes; people who are giving political contributions for the first time in their lives (like me). People who will be happy with either of the choices from "their side." People who are part of the 70+% that think the angry white men's votes in 2004 were pretty damaging to our economy, reputation, and infrastructure in their results. Yes, you are being laughed at as you twitch and writhe like a vampire in the sunlight. And I am LOVING it! I see a forecast calling for a smaller number of angry white men (due to Obamacanitis Obama+Republicans for you slow swimming angry white men), but with a drastically increased level of anger as they are forced to say President Clinton (again) or President Obama! I wish you self proclaimed anry white men could feel what it's like to have optimism in your hearts, love, and hope as you leave the house to your school, place of work, or to the volunteering that you've taken up in retirement. But, if you'd rather be the angry white guy circulating bogus emails, so be it. You can't be happy if you choose not to be?

Cheers from the optimistic and unangry black dude,

Kevin "Hack" King


Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Tue, 02/19/2008 - 7:52pm.

Experiencing Obama-mania? Laughing out loud

"Giddy" -- Having a reeling, lightheaded sensation; dizzy; woozy (producing a sensation of whirling and a tendency to fall)

Frivolous and lighthearted; flighty

• Given to lighthearted silliness: empty-headed, featherbrained, flighty, frivolous, frothy, harebrained, lighthearted, scatterbrained, silly. Informal: gaga. Slang: birdbrained, dizzy. See ability/inability.

The word giddy refers to fairly lightweight experiences or situations, but it can be traced back to the Germanic word meaning “possessed by a god.” Such possession can be a rather unbalancing experience, and so it is not surprising that its Old English descendant meant “mad, possessed by an evil spirit,” or that its Middle English development meant the same thing, as well as “foolish; mad (used of an animal); dizzy; uncertain, unstable.” Our sense “lighthearted, frivolous” represents the ultimate secularization of giddy.

Euphoria is now regarded as a state which overwhelms the personality.

In medical terms, as well as its association with such drugs [such as MDMA (‘ecstasy’) and MDEA (‘eve’)], euphoria, defined as mood elevation inappropriate to the circumstances, may accompany mental illness and diseases affecting the nervous system, such as syphilis and multiple sclerosis.

Mania is an abnormally elated mental state, typically characterized by feelings of euphoria, lack of inhibitions, racing thoughts, diminished need for sleep, talkativeness, risk taking, and irritability. In extreme cases, mania can induce hallucinations and other psychotic symptoms. {Such as "laugh[ing] as you twitch and writhe like a vampire in the sunlight."} Shocked

Mania typically occurs as a symptom of bipolar disorder (a mood disorder characterized by both manic and depressive episodes). Individuals experiencing a manic episode often have feelings of self-importance, elation, talkativeness, sociability, and a desire to embark on goal-oriented activities [such as calling for "Change!" "Change!"], coupled with the less desirable characteristics of irritability, impatience, impulsiveness [Michelle Obama: "For the first time in my adult lifetime, I am really proud of my Country"], hyperactivity, and a decreased need for sleep. (Answers.com) Eye-wink

_______________________

"Psychiatrist Explores the Psychological Causes of Modern Liberalism"

"Why are some drawn like a magnet to such classic liberal tenets as moral relativism, dependence on government, redistribution of wealth, and a philosophy of victim-hood?"

For the answers, see The Liberal Mind: The Psychological Causes of Political Madness by renowned forensic psychiatrist Dr. Lyle H. Rossiter, Jr.

"Based on strikingly irrational beliefs and emotions, modern liberals relentlessly undermine the most important principles on which our freedoms were founded," says Rossiter.

"Like spoiled, angry children, they rebel against the normal responsibilities of adulthood and demand that a parental government meet their needs from cradle to grave."

"A social scientist who understands human nature will not dismiss the vital roles of free choice, voluntary cooperation, and moral integrity -- as liberals do," adds Rossiter.

"A political leader who understands human nature will not ignore individual differences in talent, drive, personal appeal and work ethic, and then try to impose economic and social equality on the population -- as liberals do."

"And a legislator who understands human nature will not create an environment of rules which over-regulates and over-taxes the nation's citizens, corrupts their character, and reduces them to wards of the state -- as liberals do."

The Liberal Mind analyzes the psychopathology of liberalism, explaining how the liberal agenda:

*Creates and reinforces perceptions of victimization

*Satisfies infantile claims to entitlement, indulgence, and compensation

*Augments primitive feelings of envy and inferiority

*Rejects the sovereignty of the common man and subordinates him to the will of the government

"The roots of liberalism - and its associated madness - can be clearly identified by understanding how children develop from infancy to adulthood, and how distorted development produces the irrational beliefs of the liberal mind" notes Rossiter.

"When the modern liberal mind whines about imaginary victims, rages against imaginary villains, and seeks above all else to run the lives of persons competent to run their own lives, the neurosis of the liberal mind becomes painfully obvious."

_______________________

"The Socialist Brain of a Liberal Democrat"

"Naturally it took twice as much time to map it because the brain of a progressive, open-minded Democrat is always changing - as opposed to the rigid and bigoted Republican brain."

Liberalism

A normal state of a healthy person whose brain developed under the caring guidance of the progressive establishment. As opposed to the rigid and bigoted Republican/Capitalist/Conservative brain, a Liberal/Socialist/Democrat brain is hard to map because it undergoes perpetual reshuffling of its centers and synapses.

Generally it can be characterized by a compassionate concern for not taxing the rich enough, combined with generosity in spending other people's money. A liberal brain is known to have a well-developed "blame-America" synapse, a benign "Smarter Than Thou" tumor, a Global Warming Panic Center, the Entitlement Synapse, Moral Relativity Gray Area, and a "P.C. Lobe" responsible for speech codes, multiculturalism, racial quotas, and alternative lifestyles.

The underdeveloped areas of a Liberal Brain usually include those that handle common sense, personal responsibility, sense of humor, patriotism, and work ethics. The eternal motivational force that keeps a liberal going is typically a daily doze of Starbucks coffee [which contributes to irritability and sleeplessness] Eye-wink combined with the dialectical struggle of the opposites - the feeling of being a victim of oppression and the feeling of guilt for oppressing the others at the same time.

_______________________

"Fired Up and Falling Down: String of Crowd Fainting Incidents Hits Obama Rallies" Video

Are you OK? Do you need some water? Do we need to call the EMTs? Laughing out loud


Submitted by USArmybrat on Tue, 02/19/2008 - 11:44pm.

I think you are my long lost sister in this frightening battle for this wonderful country of ours!! Great retort!

AF A-10's picture
Submitted by AF A-10 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:47am.

This is truly becoming a fascinating example of conservatives abandoning yet another bedrock in the foundation of the house of conservatism. I only have to go back one day to find conservatives complaining about "hyphenated Americans." Why must they call themselves African Americans? Denise herself wrote one of her dissertations on how emphasizing the color of our skin in our titles would actually rip the fabric of America. NOW, because we have this steam roller of a candidate wrapped in a multicultural package and infecting this great nation with audacious hope, the ever shrinking group of "our time is almost up" self proclaimed "angry whites" have sought refuge here on this blog of The Citizen.
Well, there is no quarter; no refuge for you angry whites. Hope is coming for you! You will be infected. At first you will try to hide the smiles; you will be closet Obama republicans. But alas, when even John McCain says, "I now endorse Barack Obama for President" in the middle of their first debate, you will all be happily on board. Don't fear the warmth in your hearts. You will grow accustomed to it. It will have you walking with a new purpose; one of spreading hope and cooperation as we elect a man who has pledged to work with conservatives, liberals, democrats, and republicans to do the business of this great country. And guys, there will be ABSOLUTELY NO "I TOLD YOU SOs." Promise!

Cheers,

Kevin "Hack" King


sniffles5's picture
Submitted by sniffles5 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 7:47am.

Like you, I've noticed that certain people tend to talk out of both sides of their mouths when it comes to racial identification issues here! I agree that it's particularly notable with Conner, the Citizen's own Aryan Librarian. The old "Do as I say, not as I do!" double standard strikes once again!

I'm starting to think that certain folks on this site are aghast at the idea of hope. They WANT people to fear. They WANT people to despair. I find that mindset to be incomprehensible.


Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 7:16am.

You must be kidding! Laughing out loud

I'm glad that you remember my "dissertation." Thanks for the compliment! Eye-wink My post was in response to your comments, not the original post.

Maybe you should get you anti-maniac vaccination so that you won't be "infected" or at least will be able to recover. Laughing out loud

A new purpose? "Self-help books suggest that people should look within, at their own desires and dreams, but Rick Warren [actually, the Bible] says the starting place must be with God and his eternal purposes for each life. Real meaning and significance comes from understanding and fulfilling God’s purposes for putting us on earth."

I'm not looking to Obama (or any politician) as my "savior" or my hope. I already have Someone much better. Smiling

"closet Obama republicans" -- Like Hutch, I do worry that you must have hit your head really hard in that car wreck, and then the further trauma of kick-boxing. Shocked

Seriously, I'm glad you weren't put in the hospital and are OK. Enjoy your morning coffee. Smiling


hutch866's picture
Submitted by hutch866 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 12:26pm.

It's a tad early to be drinking, ain't it?
But alas, when even John McCain says, "I now endorse Barack Obama for President" in the middle of their first debate, you will all be happily on board. I don't know maybe just the pain pills they gave you after your unfortunate wreck, or maybe that last fight the guy really rang your bell. . And guys, there will be ABSOLUTELY NO "I TOLD YOU SOs." Promise! Yeah right. Can I have some of those pills?

I yam what I yam....Popeye


Submitted by thebeaver on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:10am.

Nothing but empty words, Hack. Hope without a plan is nothing.
What are we to "hope" for with Barack. He offers nothing but
more government programs for the lazy, higher taxes for the productive and hard working, socialized medicine.

Not much to hope for with this candidate, and his miserable wife has never been proud of America for her entire adult life. She probably learned that from Barack.

------------------------------------------------------------
Barack Obama is a human featherball -- a slick, smiling, substance-free empty suit who excites gullible dimwits by repeating the words “change,” “unity,” and “hope” over and over --

Submitted by skyspy on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 9:16am.

I'm with you beaver.

Empty words of "hope" and "change" without a concrete plan as to how that "change" and "hope" will occur is no plan at all. Just empty hot air.

I can't vote for someone who has never been proud of America, and won't salute our flag. My grandparents suffered and sacrificed much just for the PRIVILEDGE to be in this great country. It would be a great disrespect to their memory to vote for someone who does not love this country!!!

AF A-10's picture
Submitted by AF A-10 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:15am.

being in Iraq for 15 months: Two christmases and a return in March, you would understand hope. If you had any concern for how to pay for 1 billion dollars every two weeks, you would understand hope. Let's say you were a homeless veteran who had served this nation, but now find that you can't hold a job due to severe post traumatic stress disorder. Your current president speaks of honoring vets, but IN FACT, does nothing. You would have hope in the new guy who has ACTUALLY WORKED for people in your situation. If you don't like eavesdropping without warrants. If you like your president to speak English. If you are not a person who types blogs titled "All white people should read this" you can have hope.

As to your case Beaver, be very, very , very afraid.

Kevin "Hack" King


Submitted by thebeaver on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 9:34am.

OBAMA'S COMMUNIST MENTOR

-------------------------------------------------------------------
Barack Obama is a human featherball -- a slick, smiling, substance-free empty suit who excites gullible dimwits by repeating the words “change,” “unity,” and “hope” over and over --

sniffles5's picture
Submitted by sniffles5 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 2:08pm.

Great article on the different smear attacks being thrown at Obama:

A week of petty though typical attacks on Obama produced nothing

Article reads like a checklist of Beaver's posts:
1. "The "Che Gueverra" picture" CHECK
2. "Michelle Obama hates Amurica!" CHECK
3. "Obama is a plagiarist" CHECK
4. "Obama has a COMMIE friend!" CHECK


Submitted by skyspy on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 8:03am.

They replayed michelle obamas "mistake"(?) from Monday night for all to hear.

He should let the mrs. know he is running for president here not africa.

BPR's picture
Submitted by BPR on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 8:08am.

ABC must have got alot of calls and emails on it to replay it.

BTW- Thanks again

_______________________________
"Hope Changes Everything"


Submitted by skyspy on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 8:19am.

It was the first look into the true personality of the obamas.

Anyway I hope we get at least a little rain today. We need it.

Are your working today?

BPR's picture
Submitted by BPR on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 8:58am.

_

I have read most of the articles and like you- I have my concerns about Obama, true concerns. BYW I don't care if he is one side orange and other side purple that has nothing to do with it.

I know I read something you wrote and that is when I started looking into it- have to say you are correct.

The concerns for me - are in the articles I read- Please our hope. Not hardly some may want hope after his first 4 years but who know 8 years- believe me my hope is not in any President. I may respect some- few in my lifetime- hope in Obama? What is that all about?

I am working on one project a little today- my husband has the next two days off. So, not much- a little.

Honestly I think he might beat Hillary and McCain and I pray to God to help us all with any President. I use to think He and Hilliary were about the same in what they stand for- some- but whoooa what I read about his belief from his church- that is a concern. What is sad people don't care as long they think he is going to benefit them.

Surprised huh- well you can't keep a good gal down!Smiling I have a reason not to be down- my belief system I don't have a reason to be down.

Are you working today?

I am sure that you have done the search for Obams's church and what they believe? And I say HUH?????

______________________________
"Hope Changes Everything"


Submitted by skyspy on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 9:04am.

Crazy stuff isn't it?

Did you see ABC news last night? True beliefs and character always come out.

They say the anitchrist will fool the masses.....

Anyway, I have to leave for work. Have a good day and a good weekend.

BPR's picture
Submitted by BPR on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 10:03am.

_
I did not see the ABC news last night. This is what I believe about the antichrist. You can disagree your entitled to it.

I do believe if Obama gets President and wants us to believe his belief system it may be a step to the antichrist. It is very confusing their belief system- author of confusion?

We have moved alot because of my husband's job- and every church that we have gone to has said when we study it that it has to be someone in power ( the antichrist) he/she will have to tell us what to do and believe.

Before all of this happens with the 666 thing- Christians will be rapture to heaven. Then things will really get bad.

We are to also look for signs- well where is our belief systems in morals, and there are many gods, and if it's your thing do it- it's okay, plus others. The ones that believe in many gods believe in Jesus as a good person but he is not God's Son- The Savior. Who is the author of confusion? Huum.

There had to be a sacrifice to pay for our sins, that sacrifice was God's Son(Jesus). Do Christians still mess up, yep-
we are still human but being Christian we want to do what the bible tells us, but we have free-will and sometimes we go by the temptation.
Do we loose Jesus, no the sacrifice has been paid and we can be restored.

If you are not a true believer the anitchrist will fool you- you will believe what he/she says is the pie in the sky.

I remember when this song came out it was on MTV- very good.

click here

This is a person's view of what could happen- Great Video.

Obama's Church Belief System: A Bit Confusing?

click here

______________________________
"Hope Changes Everything"


Submitted by sageadvice on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 11:12am.

Maybe you can explain it to me?
How could someone who is close to God, even speaks to Him and gets spoken to, ever, ever continue to violate that knowledge by being evil, hurting others, constantly making excuses for things that you need forgiveness for?
Wouldn't that either be the height of ignorance, or simply not true?

hutch866's picture
Submitted by hutch866 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 10:09am.

I've got ask you this, you talk about the one true God, your God, does this mean that the Buddhists are all going to Hell? How about the Jews are they going? Are the tribes down in South America who hardly ever see a white man going to Hell, the Muslims? Just curious and just asking?

I yam what I yam....Popeye


hutch866's picture
Submitted by hutch866 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 5:47pm.

Never mind, I'm sorry I asked, please disregard.

I yam what I yam....Popeye


sniffles5's picture
Submitted by sniffles5 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 10:14am.

That's an excellent topic and something I've wondered about too.

Would you start a blog entry on this so we're not scruched up against the right margin here? I'd do it myself but didn't want to step on you.


hutch866's picture
Submitted by hutch866 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 10:33am.

I was hesitant to even ask this for fear of you and main and doc beating up on her when ya'll don't agree, but curiosity got the better of me. Maybe if bpr fells like replying to this she can put it in a blog herself. I do appreciate the courtesy you showed though. I hope if she does reply you can show her the same courtesy as this is one of the more volatile subjects on here.

I yam what I yam....Popeye


Main Stream's picture
Submitted by Main Stream on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 4:52pm.

Hutch, please do a search of bpr's posts and you'll see that she has been the one "beating up" on people regarding god, jesus and religion. Your friendship for her is admirable, however, do not put ANY of this on me or the others. That's offensive. She has brought this on herself.

------------------------
GOD BLESS THIS MESS


hutch866's picture
Submitted by hutch866 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 5:45pm.

Not to be offensive, but I met her once, just like I met you and snif, so I don't think you can call us friends, no more then you can call you and me friends. I asked her some questions about her religion and really want to hear her answers but not if she has to defend those answers to everyone on this site. I might add that ya'll gave as good as you got, and it was 3 to 1 against, and I laugh at how it's never anyone's fault on these boards except the other guy. I'm not saying she or anyone else was blameless and to tell you the truth I retract the question to her and if I can I will erase the post. Good day to you.

I yam what I yam....Popeye


Main Stream's picture
Submitted by Main Stream on Fri, 02/22/2008 - 9:03pm.

I just really question whether some folks who blog on here, have the mental fortitude and stability to discuss their personal religious beliefs on here. It's like standing naked in front of everyone, and if people can't bear (bare) to hear the criticism, or alternate beliefs, without self-destructing, then maybe they should post somewhere else. I agree, it would be interesting to hear some alternate beliefs but it always seems to take a personal turn, like when I was told I believe in multiple gods and I had horrible parenting skills, etc. by you know who.

Anyway hutch, I'm still in Asheville, loving this place, put I've noticed so much has happened on the blog, like Truth leaving and Shadow being banned - yikes. I appreciate your honesty and kindness.

------------------------
GOD BLESS THIS MESS


BPR's picture
Submitted by BPR on Sat, 02/23/2008 - 8:18am.

I am sorry that I offended you- I am glad that you enjoy Asheville-it's my home town. All my relatives are still there. I go from time to time to visit them. It's really beautiful in the fall the leaves turn such beautiful colors.

I will not address this issue with you again, I did say I was sorry that I offended you.

Now, it's up here for everyone to see. It's behind me. If I mention the name God just don't read it-

I don't like being at odds with anyone, so I'm making peace. All I can do is say I am sorry.

Enjoy your stay in Asheville.

_______________________________
"Hope Changes Everything"


rock78's picture
Submitted by rock78 on Fri, 02/22/2008 - 10:58pm.

I won't question BPR/Lilly's, mental capabilities, but given the reasoning for her "study" - we all have to admit that she has only given "True Christians" less credibility on this blog. She actually questioned Muddle – who comes across as one of the only reasonable posters on this blog when religion has been discussed.

Basically, anyone who doesn’t attend church on Sunday will be assured a spot in eternal damnation. Frankly, her position only reaffirms that of Sniffles/Main and the other "lefties" on this site....I don't want to be associated with her views, and I am a conservative and a Christian.


Main Stream's picture
Submitted by Main Stream on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:31pm.

Gosh, I'm only out of town for a few days and all Repug heck breaks loose on here! Looks like beaver and denise are at it again, huh. Another smear campaign as usual. Well, I guess it keeps all of us off the streets, eh.

Hey, Asheville is pretty cool, almost like Boulder, and my 'COEXIST' bumper sticker fits in just fine here. The mountains are beautiful and there's a hot tub back at the farmhouse, so.... I'll be off for now and toast you all as I'm gazing at the moon tonight.

Peace, y'all. And be nice (but not too nice)!

------------------------
GOD BLESS THIS MESS


yardman5508's picture
Submitted by yardman5508 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:54pm.

glad you are enjoying the mountains. I am sure that the "breath of fresh air" is invigorating, in more ways than one. We are holding down the fort here in the flatland. Girding our loins, donning our suit of lights, beating our plowshares into swords, etc. Have a great stay, and keep the faith.

Democracy is not a spectator sport.


Submitted by thebeaver on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:51pm.

Here's Senator Kirk Watson, who supports B. Hussein Obama for President, in an interview with Mr. Hardball himself, Chris Matthews.

Senator Watson cannot name one legislative accomplishment by Obama!
Not one!! All he can do is spit out "he inspires people".
Listen for yourself - you can't make this stuff up.

Obama campaign rep STUMPED on legislative accomplishments

Hell, if inspiration is all that it takes -

Hitler inspired people
Mussolini inspired people
Castro inspired people
Charles Manson inspired his followers.

How in the heck does smooth talking and a bunch of empty words qualify someone for POTUS??? The Dems that are supporting him are in a hypnotic trance over this guy. Amazing how people can get taken in by smooth talk from an empty suit.

Wake up from the trance, sheeple.........

------------------------------------------------------------
Barack Obama is a human featherball -- a slick, smiling, substance-free empty suit who excites gullible dimwits by repeating the words “change,” “unity,” and “hope” over and over --

Submitted by thebeaver on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:11pm.

Here's Senator Kirk Watson, who supports B. Hussein Obama for President, in an interview with Mr. Hardball himself, Chris Matthews.

Senator Watson cannot name one legislative accomplishment by Obama!
Not one!! All he can do is spit out "he inspires people".
Listen for yourself - you can't make this stuff up.

Obama campaign rep STUMPED on legislative accomplishments

Hell, if inspiration is all that it takes -

Hitler inspired people
Mussolini inspired people
Castro inspired people
Charles Manson inspired his followers.

How in the heck does smooth talking and a bunch of empty words qualify someone for POTUS??? The Dems that are supporting him are in a hypnotic trance over this guy. Amazing how people can get taken in by smooth talk from an empty suit.

Wake up from the trance, sheeple.........

------------------------------------------------------------
Barack Obama is a human featherball -- a slick, smiling, substance-free empty suit who excites gullible dimwits by repeating the words “change,” “unity,” and “hope” over and over --

Submitted by sageadvice on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 5:15am.

I hope you invented, "audacity of hype," because it is a good one.

Fact is, they can't be specific in what they propose or it will be cut to pieces immediately!

Imagine specifics on: Health care; immigration; the economy (CCCcamps maybe); debt; credit card elimination; tough to get a loan of any kind; job security (republicans would have a hissy); term limits for politicians; Iraq; Afghanistan; Pakistan; Iran; North Korea; Afrioan genocide; The Russians; The Chinese; The Muslims; The Border; (other than build a big wall); Mexico; Central and South America (Hugo);California in general (esp, San Francisco); Southern boobs (not female type); Upper, middle, lower classes; Corporate crooks to jail; immediate jobs for everyone doing anything (WPA type); and on and on!

Submitted by thebeaver on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:12pm.

Here's Senator Kirk Watson, who supports B. Hussein Obama for President, in an interview with Mr. Hardball himself, Chris Matthews.

Senator Watson cannot name one legislative accomplishment by Obama!
Not one!! All he can do is spit out "he inspires people".
Listen for yourself - you can't make this stuff up.

Obama campaign rep STUMPED on legislative accomplishments

Hell, if inspiration is all that it takes -

Hitler inspired people
Mussolini inspired people
Castro inspired people
Charles Manson inspired his followers.

How in the heck does smooth talking and a bunch of empty words qualify someone for POTUS??? The Dems that are supporting him are in a hypnotic trance over this guy. Amazing how people can get taken in by smooth talk from an empty suit.

Wake up from the trance, sheeple.........

----------------------------------------------------------

Barack Obama is a human featherball -- a slick, smiling, substance-free empty suit who excites gullible dimwits by repeating the words “change,” “unity,” and “hope” over and over --

yardman5508's picture
Submitted by yardman5508 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:00pm.

who was never even a legislator to have any legislative accomplishments, and whose administrative accomplishments include executing more people as governor than any other in modern memory, and being the nominal owner of a professional baseball team. Keep the faith.

Democracy is not a spectator sport.


Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 10:55pm.

Talk about bringing up old news Eye-wink

The president is part of the EXECUTIVE branch, not the legislative branch. President Bush (notice the respectful form of address vs. "Dubya") as governor of Texas had EXECUTIVE experience, just as former President Clinton had EXECUTIVE experience as governor of Arkansas. President Clinton ran for the House of Representatives (legislative branch) but was defeated by the incumbent.

As far as Gov. Bush's role in the death penalty executions in Texas, here's a quote from The New York Times:

"As governor, Mr. Bush's only independent authority is to grant a 30-day reprieve of an execution. He cannot pardon someone or commute a death sentence without the prior recommendation of the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles. Under those circumstances, he has commuted only one death sentence in his five years in office, sparing the life of Henry Lee Lucas, a confessed serial killer.

"But this was the first time that Mr. Bush agreed to a reprieve for a death-row inmate, and he did it against the wishes of the pardons board, which had voted, 11 to 7, not to stay Mr. McGinn's execution. For the moment, that action merely delays Mr. McGinn's execution."

Let me see.... A JURY convicts criminals (a "democratic" process -- "Unlike juries in many states, those in Texas do not have the option of life without parole."), and the courts (JUDICIAL branch) review and review death penalty cases so that it's YEARS before a death sentence is finally carried out, and you blame the governor for adhering to the "will of the people"? Puzzled

"The [TX] state appeals court [JUDICIAL branch] has reversed only eight death penalty cases in the last five years [as of 2000], while affirming the convictions and death sentences in 256 cases, according to court statistics."

"Texas also puts a premium on the speed of its executions, aided by an appeals court that rarely overturns capital cases and a clemency board that has voted only once to stop an execution."

"Mr. Bush has been praised by victims' rights groups. 'The families of victims want resolution.'"

As of 2000, "Texas leads the nation in executions." So, wouldn't you expect the duly elected governor to follow the "will of the people" (in "a fiercely pro-death-penalty state") who elected him? He even refused to bow to pressure to grant clemency to the ax-murderess Karla Faye Tucker, who claimed to have become a born-again Christian while in prison. Tucker had the distinction of being "the first woman executed in Texas since the Civil War and the first in the United States since 1984." (Gender bias?)

"Under state law, Texas governors do not have the power to commute death penalty sentences, only to briefly postpone an execution pending further review by the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles."

Of course, "no one can point with certainty to a case in which an innocent person has been executed here since Texas reinstated the death penalty in 1976."

"Ann W. Richards, the liberal Democratic governor who preceded Mr. Bush, presided over the executions of a then-record 50 death row inmates." Those executed under Gov. Bush numbered 127 (113, according to Salon).

I must have missed your calls for President Bush commute the sentences of U.S. Border Patrol agents Ramos and Compean. Puzzled

"[Lou] Dobbs: Time to Free Ramos and Compean"

"Bush Slammed as Border Patrol Agents Begin Prison Terms"

I'd guess that a poll of Ga. citizens would not be pleased with the very costly delays ("lawyers defending capital cases to try to bankrupt the system by running up huge fees and expenses" amounting to $2 million) in the Brian Nichols' case.

From my perspective, this country bends over backwards to ascertain the guilt of criminals. Are there failures? Yes, I'm sad to say, but show me a better system (besides doing away with the death penalty). Perhaps if criminals were sentenced to actual life sentences instead of being able to get out on parole after only a few years and prisons didn't provide such pleasant accommodations and prisoners were forced to work to pay for their upkeep (instead of watching TV and gang fighting), then we might reconsider the death penalty.

I suppose you're a closet supporter of Gov. Huckabee, who's been criticized by conservatives for the large number of pardons and commutations he granted? Puzzled Laughing out loud


yardman5508's picture
Submitted by yardman5508 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 11:14pm.

why do you wait until so late in the evening to drop those massive missives on me? I was just about to head to bed before my "yardman-radar" picked up a disturbance. *sigh* Where to begin?

I was merely stating a response to the beav's NUMEROUS postings about Mr. Obama's lack of a legislative record as grounds to keep him from the presidency. I pointed out the Mr. Bush the Younger had NO legislative record and he was appointed,...oops, my bad...elected to that high office.

and as for his administrative experience...I can hardly believe that you used his name and "the will of the people" in the same sentence, what with the support for his war heading toward the single digits. Adhering to the will of the people? Mr. "unitary presidency" himself? tsk, tsk. Let us be careful least we try to have it both ways.

And now it is off to bed with me, to sleep, perchance to dream. Keep the faith.

Democracy is not a spectator sport.


Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 6:48am.

Somehow you Dems always manage to throw in THE WAR and how Pres. Bush wasn't really elected, no matter what the topic! Yawn..... Laughing out loud

I believe that it is wise to consider Sen. Obama's experience or lack thereof when considering him for the most important job in the world. Since he only began his Senate term in 2005 and "has missed the most votes of any Democratic presidential hopeful in the Senate over the last two months [nearly 80% during Sept. & Oct., as well as 27 of 30 votes in Dec. & 10 of 21 for Jan. & early Feb.], including a vote on an Iran resolution he has blasted Sen. Hillary Clinton for supporting," I think that his inexperience definitely should be considered. He did serve in the Illinois Senate from 1997 to 2004, but he (as well as the other top candidates) lacks executive experience.

The point of my post was your not comparing apples with apples and throwing in an ad hominem attack. Sad


"Obama Making Less than a Quarter of Senate Votes"


"Clinton leads Obama in Missed Senate Votes"


Votes Database: Missing Votes

Sen. Obama has missed 182 votes (38.8%) during the current Congress, Sen. Clinton has missed 127 votes (27.1%), and Sen. McCain has missed 261 votes (55.7%).

I'm all for requiring senators to resign when campaigning for another office or at least earning their pay by being present to vote.

______________________


"Obamamania Verges on Obsession"
Excerpts

Maryland Congressman Elijah Cummings: "This is not a campaign for president of the United States, this is a movement to change the world."

"He walks into a room and you want to follow him somewhere, anywhere," George Clooney told talk show host Charlie Rose.

"I'll do whatever he says to do," actress Halle Berry said to the Philadelphia Daily News. "I'll collect paper cups off the ground to make his pathway clear."

Thousands of screaming, cheering, and sometimes even crying supporters [Obama-maniacs] regularly come out to hear him talk.

His most fervent backers fall in love with his idealistic message of change — irrelevant of the dry details — his youth, and his powerful [Elvis-like rock star] presence on the stump. For some, the affair can border on obsession.

In Chicago, a recent art exhibit showed works depicting the candidate on canvas, paper and even in animated videos.

Some of the posters are vaguely reminiscent of classic Soviet propaganda, with a large, benevolent-looking Obama staring out from the paper. The artists plan to tour their "independent political propaganda campaign" across the country.

______________________


"Clinton Attacks Obama as All Talk, Little Substance"

"We need to dream big, but you know, dreams alone won't make anything. We've got to have solutions to the problems that face us."

"Clinton belittled Obama as an inexperienced choice for commander-in-chief in a dangerous world, for advocating a health care plan that is not as expansive as hers [that really disturbs me Shocked ] and for giving airy speeches."

"This country has given me so many opportunities," Clinton said. "I am proud of the United States of America."

[Although Sen. Clinton can't quite pull off a rock star image (the majority of her adoring fans are 95-year-old grandmas Eye-wink), she is the "smartest woman in the world," you know. Laughing out loud ]


"Does Hillary Posses [sic] the Experience & Judgment To Be President?"


"Barack Obama Is a Fake"

"Obama, like JFK, is a media creation. He's sponsored no significant legislation during his time in the Senate. He's never run a tough election race. He's flipped his position on Iraq and flipped back. He's never made an important statement in any of his speeches, unless slogans cribbed from Politics for Dummies count.... While Obama is just as manufactured as JFK was, he's half as qualified and twice as phony."

"JFK made clear his positions on the issues -- Obama obfuscates, repeating the word "change" as though it were a magical talismanic incantation. Which it is, as far as his empty-headed constituents are concerned."


"Hillary Clinton and John McCain: What Kind of 'Experience'?"

______________________

Now, the latest political "news" from HuffPo:


"There's More to Cindy McCain than Meets the Serial-Killer Blue Eye"
[Catchy title, isn't it?]

Cindy McCain inserted herself into the flap over Michelle Obama's supposedly anti-American comments, telling supporters in Wisconsin, "I'm proud of my country, I don't know about you, if you heard those words earlier." Left-wing blog Daily Kos returned fire with a detailed history of Cindy McCain's problems with Percocet.

Since this is the first time Cindy has piped up in this campaign, it's time to ask — who is this GOP frontrunner's wife? And how can she be distinguished from her doppelgangers, which include every man's second wife and Jessica Lange's character in "Blue Skies"? 23/6 investigates.

______________________

And from the Daily Kos (This one is just too good to excerpt.):


"Sorry Cindy McCain, It's Time to Take the Gloves Off"

I really don't care if McCain's trophy wife is proud of her country. She is just another GOP Stepford Wife as vacant as the previous ones. Whoopie for anorexic-looking Cindy McCain in her red $5000 Yves St. Laurent power suit, with her triple string of cultured pearls, her bleached blond hair and her shiny new face-lift telling us she's proud of America. Prouder of America than --- hmmmm, let's say Michelle Obama.

John McCain follows the usual "family values" profile of Republican social climbers. He divorced first wife Carol in April 1980 and married Cindy one month later. Infidelity? Hell no!... they were just "friends."

Cindy who is 18 years younger than Gramps McCain and she paid for McCain's first campaign for Congress in 1982 with loans from her well endowed trust fund. Her father's business and political contacts helped gain her husband a foothold into Arizona politics.

Cindy's biggest claim to fame is in 1989 she developed an addiction to perocet and vicodin [sic: Percocet (oxycodone with acetaminophen) and Vicodin (hydrocodone and acetaminophen)], two powerful morphine based pain killers. In 1993 she was caught stealing percocet [sic] from supply of the American Voluntary Medical Team, a charity she founded to provide health care and medications to war victims in underdeveloped nations. The DEA was investigated her [sic] and with the intervention of her well connected parents and McCain himself, Cindy got off the hook with the usual 90 day trip to the posh rehab. The American Voluntary Medical Team folded shortly after it ceased to be a supply point for Cindy's opiate habit.

The DEA agreed to keep Cindy's little misadventure in Lala Land from the public, but then Cindy went and terminated the guy who reported her to the DEA and the details of Cindy's sordid past as a suburban trophy wife junkie all came out when the fired guy filed a wrongful termination suit against Cindy.

A few weeks after Cindy came clean about her addiction the Variety Club cancelled her Humanitarian of the Year Award. Boo hoo!... Another respectable Republican mother of the Harper Valley PTA goes down. This is just a little Peyton Place of Republican family values and Cindy's a Harper Valley hypocrite.

John McCain kept Cindy under wraps during his bid for the presidency but now that she's out there telling us she's way prouder of America than Michelle Obama, So I'm doing America a service by telling the truth, and nothing but the whole truth about Cindy.

Michelle Obama is proud of America too, but she's not Republican, garden club, percocet munching ex-cheerleader like Cindy. And she doesn't steal drugs from charitable organizations.

Michelle never had a trust fund like Cindy and she grew up under humble circumstances on Chicago's South Side. Her father was a pump operator and she managed to overcome her disadvantages as a working class black woman and attend Princeton then she graduated from Harvard Law School and met Barak at a law office where they worked together, shortly after Barack receive his law degree from Harvard. Michelle has paid enough dues to be far more credible than dozen stoned out Republican trophy wives when she tells you she is proud of America. America should be proud of Michelle Obama.

The whole thing is a bunch of nonsense. Most people have the common sense to understand what this political posturing and xenophobic flag waving from the McCain camp is all about. Call me harsh, but I'm tired of Republicans wrapping themselves in the flag and smearing perfectly decent Americans. It's time to take off the gloves.

______________________


"For McCain, Self-Confidence on Ethics Poses Its Own Risk"

Innuendo about an adulterous "romantic" relationship with a lobbyist but no substantiation -- Now that's how to report the news! Shocked

I do wonder when The New York Times will do such in-depth investigative reporting on Sen. Obama & Clinton. Puzzled

So, can I count on you for another generous contribution to Gov. Huckabee's campaign? Eye-wink

As far as it being late, we "vampires" (Hack's term of endearment) keep late and early hours. Laughing out loud


BPR's picture
Submitted by BPR on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:50pm.

I am doing fine, how about yourself? I have been busy with projects, out of school for the week.

_______________________________
"Hope Changes Everything"


Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 6:53am.

I can't find a way to email you at Fayette Net. You don't seem to be a member any longer. So, let me know how to contact you. Smiling


Submitted by sageadvice on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 9:28am.

I didn't want to re-print your latest missive of lengthiness to answer you, so I'll use this little BPR thingee:

Obama does not have much Washington Experience and thank goodness he has not worked for Exxon or some Bank, so he will have to depend upon his University training and several years as a politician to be President. About like Jack Kennedy.

I won't be voting for him if McCain makes it through until election day--I am an Independent for now.

What many like you aren't understanding, because you don't want to, is that the current administration, along with the total idiots on talk radio, and columnists on the right wing have destroyed the republican party and Hillary gets thrown is with the "establishment."

Crooks by the score in business, bank failures, hidden inflation, lies, unnecessary and too long wars, spying on us, ignoring citizen's health, fostering big oil's goals, pretending to be religious, ignoring our terrible lower schools, and borrowing us blind with our real enemies---ones who could really destroy us.

sniffles5's picture
Submitted by sniffles5 on Thu, 02/21/2008 - 9:36am.

There was a poll out yesterday that indicated that 77% of Americans disapproved of the job George W. Bush is doing as President (or to put it in Republican-speak: "77% of Americans hate America")
LINK

All-time lows for the "Decider".


BPR's picture
Submitted by BPR on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:43pm.

How are you, I am doing fine, I am so glad you enjoy Asheville, that is my home town.

BTW I am still here- the nail is not in the coffin.Laughing out loud

_______________________________
"Hope Changes Everything"


yardman5508's picture
Submitted by yardman5508 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 2:18pm.

it will only get worse as the general election draws nearer. Keep the faith.

Democracy is not a spectator sport.


sniffles5's picture
Submitted by sniffles5 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 2:23pm.

It's all they know, Yardman, the 24 hour attack cycle.

Yet more and more people, across virtually every demographic, are turning out for Obama in record numbers.

The Republican message of "all fear, all the time" just hasn't struck a responsive chord with voters this year.


Submitted by thebeaver on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 9:23am.

Is Obama a (or the) Messiah?

It's hard to determine how good a man would be as POTUS when he votes "present" on important bills that affect the American people.

I would like to know what hope means to Barack. He says it enough, but he has never defined it.

His words are nothing but fluffy bunnies and rainbows. No substance.
We have no idea what he would do to the country because he won't tell us.

Tell me, Hack, what specifically has Barack done as a Senator that warrants anyone to vote for him. There are a lot of good motivational speakers out there like Barack, but that doesn't necessarily make them qualified to be voted in as POTUS.

Hillary is going to steal the nomination from him anyway with the Michigan and Florida delegates and the "super-delegates", and then the riots will begin......
Wilder Goes Wild, Threatens Riots at Convention If Superdelegates Don't Switch to Obama

This is gonna be fun to watch!!

Barack Obama is a human featherball -- a slick, smiling, substance-free empty suit who excites gullible dimwits by repeating the words “change,” “unity,” and “hope” over and over --

sniffles5's picture
Submitted by sniffles5 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 2:01pm.

Submitted by Hey on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 1:16pm.

He's not the Messiah, but he could be the Antichrist.

Submitted by sageadvice on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 2:08pm.

why would either bother running for President?

Submitted by Hey on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 2:42pm.

Because the Antichrist is supposed to be a world leader who decieves the masses.

Tug13's picture
Submitted by Tug13 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 3:19pm.

Well, that description fits Hillary Clinton.


Submitted by Hey on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 4:57pm.

It really could fit any of them.

TonyF's picture
Submitted by TonyF on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:08am.

I would have more respect("more" would not be at all difficult) for this person if he admitted who he was instead of "Uncle Tom"ing his way to the nomination. Hell, if spoke ebonically and grabbed his package every two seconds while he smokes his Blunt or at least let his pants droop to show his ass and wore a do-rag he could be a credit to his heritage, but as it is, he's just a wanna-be whitey lying to everyone including himself.

O wad some Power the giftie gie us,To see oursels as ithers see us!
(R. Burns)
If we could see ourselves as others see us, we would vanish on the spot.
(E. M. Cioran)


AF A-10's picture
Submitted by AF A-10 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:19am.

But I honestly can't see where you are coming from here. I am seeing the next JFK in Obama. I'm seeing a guy who will not run from his past or get his lawyers to bury it. I see a stand up guy with a mixed heritage he is proud of. I'm on board; State after state after state is on board. It will take some hard, cold facts to knock me off, and I just don't see those coming from the bah humbug party. I'm content with being happy as a tourist in Rio de Janeiro Smiling

Kevin "Hack" King


NUK_1's picture
Submitted by NUK_1 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:58pm.

I will give credit to Obama for not trying to avoid/cover up past indiscretions and even being very direct about using recreational drugs like coke. Sort of reminded me of a California state rep(and a Repub even) who has been re-elected about 10 times who said "I did everything except drink the bongwater." LOL. The honesty is appreciated.

Of course, it helps Obama that the media so far hasn't been dogging him at every stop about what he did as a teenager either. I don't think I've ever seen a presidential candidate with a serious chance get treated so gingerly thus far. I see that changing soon.


TonyF's picture
Submitted by TonyF on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 8:36am.

I am just so blankety-blank tired of being the cause of all America's problems because I was unfortunate enough to be born a caucasian male. Middle-aged white men are the most reviled segment of our and the world's population. No point here, just a vent. I don't dislike him because he's black, I do because he's not. If you(all) don't get that, then there's no need to try and explain it.
(1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10) All better now.

O wad some Power the giftie gie us,To see oursels as ithers see us!
(R. Burns)
If we could see ourselves as others see us, we would vanish on the spot.
(E. M. Cioran)


Submitted by sageadvice on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 9:38am.

I think you are very nearly correct on this one. First time.
I don't expect Obama or his wife (both from Harvard) to dance with a banjo, eat fried chicken and watermelon on the stage, always talking about the "man," and always asking for "answers" (money), but I do expect him to be more specific with his promises--which he and McCain will have to do for the rest of this year. That will do him in I'm afraid, providing he can beat Clinton!

TonyF's picture
Submitted by TonyF on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 9:46am.

I like turtles.
p.s. I told you not to talk to or address me at any time.

O wad some Power the giftie gie us,To see oursels as ithers see us!
(R. Burns)
If we could see ourselves as others see us, we would vanish on the spot.
(E. M. Cioran)


Submitted by sageadvice on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 5:20am.

I didn't read Denise--couldn't find the bottom line after five minutes, but she seems to have snapped after her flu!

hutch866's picture
Submitted by hutch866 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:25am.

Type slower, dollar having trouble keeping up.

I yam what I yam....Popeye


Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 4:17am.

Thank you for your kind words, sister! We do have a wonderful country. Smiling


NUK_1's picture
Submitted by NUK_1 on Mon, 02/18/2008 - 8:45am.

I'll change my opinion that Obama is a naive and fairly unknown candidate besides the usual liberal when he lays out what is vision exactly is. Until then, he sounds like the second coming of an "outsider" like Jimmy Carter in way over his head.

Running a campaign on vision alone works in local races a lot better than presidential elections. After he disposes of Shillary, the Repubs are going to beat him over the head big on foreign policy and whether Obama is the person you want as a commander in chief. It's all they got since they forfeited the right to anything resembling "fiscal conservatism," but the foreign policy/national defense club is still a powerful tool for the Repubs. The media is going to start grinding on him too instead of kissing the ground he walks on. Same with McCain for that matter, another media darling who soon they'll be slicing and dicing.

I don't think "angry white men" are really a factor. There will always be the disillusioned fringe that join goofy things like the "Patriot" movement or think that Ed Brown the tax evader moron or Eric Rudolph are some kind of "heroes." The mass electorate is a little bit more thoughtful. Hmmm......maybe. Whether they are thoughtful enough to demand something from Obama besides being a good speaker is another matter, and something that will be seen shortly. I'm thinking his 15 minutes of fame are about up and the media honeymoon will be ending shortly.

If the Repubs were running someone besides Bob Dole v2.0, this upcoming election wouldn't be close, even with the past several years of Republican ineptitude. Dems running Obama and Clinton really is helping the Repubs when they need it the most. One candidate has a rock-solid 50% hatred that doesn't waver a bit and the other wants to sit down with Iranian lunatics for a fireside chat. The fact that both are trying to make history as "first ever....." helps the Repubs even more.No matter how enlightened or 21st century people sound when the media or someone is talking face-to-face, they tend not to be so open-minded when they get to the voting booth. When David Duke won in the Louisiana House race, he was polling at under 10% throughout the race until election day where he got 51%.


AF A-10's picture
Submitted by AF A-10 on Tue, 02/19/2008 - 12:25pm.

"After he disposes of Shillary, the Repubs are going to beat him over the head big on foreign policy and whether Obama is the person you want as a commander in chief."

Nuk, republicans will do very, very little damage to Barack Obama beating him over the head with a foam pool float with "stay in Iraq 100 years" on it. Heck, that will be like throwing money at a guy to make him poor. Smiling

"If the Repubs were running someone besides Bob Dole v2.0, this upcoming election wouldn't be close,"

NUK, obviously you think this election is about the personality and not the policies. In essence, you are saying if John McCain was more likable (like Obama) the nation would willingly and readily swallow the policies. I believe you are way, way off the mark. Americans don't seem to like open-ended wars, troubled economic policies, and status quo politics. I'm not sure why conservatives are putting so much effort into minimizing the effect of inspiring people. Do we remember the best man behind an M-1 rifle in WWI, or do we remember the eloquent generals that inspired men to die for their country; for a cause? Do we remember the foot soldiers at the point, or the words of General Patton that motivated those men to take up their arms and charge? I truly believe that I am watching both Hillary Clinton and many conservatives commit suicide by telling people to ignore that warm, positive feeling they get inside when they hear words of inspiriation. That message would not work in my church. And I feel it will fail you, Hillary, the Beav, McCain, and everyone else that attempts to put hope in a pillow case, tie it off, and throw it in a river to drown.

Other than that, I agree with everything you said Laughing out loud

Kevin "Hack" King


NUK_1's picture
Submitted by NUK_1 on Tue, 02/19/2008 - 1:30pm.

I definitely think it's a lot about policies come November; it's not right now though, and that helps Obama who isn't deep into that and is gaining momentum by being vague and going for the "vision thing" instead of addressing just what his platform is besides "let's all work together." Pool float or big stick, the Repubs are going to hammer him on all of his "present" voting in the state legislature and his high liberal ratings and try to force-out exactly where he stands on the big issues of our time.

I said McCain is Dole v2.0 not because he is dull and uninspiring like Dole was, it's because both were/are from the the moderate-left spectrum that makes for candidates that Repub voters in general don't like. Guys like Dole, Ford and Bush I and now McCain have policies that the Repub base from the fundamentalists on to fiscal conservatives don't like. So, the thumpers don't like their policies, and the limited govt and fiscal conservatives don't like them. So much for too much Repub support when you have those 2 large Repub blocs against you.

I'm all for hope and inspiration, but I want it tempered with reality.


AF A-10's picture
Submitted by AF A-10 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:53am.

"I'm all for hope and inspiration, but I want it tempered with reality."

NUK, reality of 19 Feb: Wisconsin and Hawaii are on board. There is no stopping the will of this country friend; no bogus emails; no false claims of failure to salute the flag, Muslim faith, gay affairs. Conservatives are throwing themselves under locamotives trying to stop this swell. I'm hoping they'll "come down off the ledge my friend" (Third Eye Blind) and join the rest of us. I see a new day coming. And I believe all will be pleasantly surprised.

Cheers,

Kevin "Hack" King


Submitted by sageadvice on Mon, 02/18/2008 - 9:37am.

I'm not voting for Obama but the very last thing we need as President is another "Commander-In-Chief."
That is our current problem, we have a huge organization in the defense department and the service academies plus the State department to advise on war.
We need someone as President with some sense to make the decisions when necessary.

yardman5508's picture
Submitted by yardman5508 on Mon, 02/18/2008 - 8:59am.

and you don't think that the Democratic poohbahs are just lusting after a chance to bring the last 8 years of foreign policy to the forefront? That is sort of like someone throwing a left hook and their opponent leaning into it. I will grant you that Obama might not have all the "Washington experience" of McCain, but he is certainly no Jimmy Carter {not that that would be such a bad thing given the current state of international relations}. It is going to be interesting. Keep the faith.

Democracy is not a spectator sport.


sniffles5's picture
Submitted by sniffles5 on Mon, 02/18/2008 - 3:25am.

Hack, there's a pretty good reply to this claptrap here:
Responding to columnist Gary Hubbell's 'Angry White Men' essay


AF A-10's picture
Submitted by AF A-10 on Tue, 02/19/2008 - 12:31pm.

I'm sure you were hoping for someone to step in between your post and the frothing pot of hate stew underneath yours.

Kevin "Hack" King


Submitted by thebeaver on Fri, 02/15/2008 - 12:29pm.

"Barack Obama is a human featherball -- a slick, smiling, substance-free empty suit who excites gullible dimwits by repeating the words “change,” “unity,” and “hope” over and over --"

Great Article on how Barak is nothing but a man full of empty words -

Barack Obama: A Human Hallmark Card For President?

--------------------------------------------------------

“...the term “democrat” originated as an epithet and referred to ‘one who panders to the crude and mindless whims of the DUMB masses.’”

Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Sun, 02/17/2008 - 5:01pm.

I like that guy's style!

"Barack Obama: A Human Hallmark Card For President?" -- Something to THINK about.

As Herman Cain says, "There's no Department of Happy."

Theodore Dalrymple's "Mind Forg’d Manacles"

"The Left’s belief in the helplessness of the poor is a self-fulfilling prophecy."

"What Habermas fails to recognize is that self-destruction — which he correctly implies has reached epidemic proportions among a segment of the population — grows out of attitudes to life, beliefs, and mentalities; it is not a mechanical response to a mechanical problem. And one of the beliefs that favors self-destruction is that no alternative to it is possible, because the world is so constituted, at least until the people’s saviors gain power, that one’s choices make no difference to the course of one’s life .... But it is not true."


BPR's picture
Submitted by BPR on Mon, 02/18/2008 - 3:08am.

_Just one last question- I guess you are not going to email.

I get it you said I didn't have credibility to someone, so I guess you think you can't be my friend? I think - if I am not wrong you said it to Hack.

The lessons we learn in life- Dr. Denise

I know we differ - but what about this- I am not perfect- I am still a Christian- GRACE

BTW before you read what I am going to say don't tell me oh, this is your ticket to sin.

No Condemnation:

Romans 8:1

"Therefore there is now no condemnation for them who are in Christ Jesus".

(Thank God)

Grace of God is cause of our justification- this is when I fail.

Romans 3:24 Being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus.

So, if you think I have failed and I say I am a Christian- credibility? Only one is perfect and I think you know who that is.

Credibility?

I leave you Denise in peace- Thank God for His Grace.

If you respond on here, I will not discuss this- I just had this one thing to say- I told you where I would respond- but only in 2 weeks then that is over.

"Amazing Grace"

______________________________
"Hope Changes Everything"


AF A-10's picture
Submitted by AF A-10 on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:59am.

I hope things have calmed for you a bit. These boards can be absolutely brutal at one twist, and filled with compassion (one good guy) the next. There is no explanation. It is what it is. You will also notice that our memories at times are short. Once you put the bad stuff behind you, it will try to stay there. I'm still your buddy. I am very glad Lilly is gone though Smiling . With your amazing husband's permission, I hope to have a great big bear hug for you so that you know God's love transcends politics and blogs. Have a great day, and if you see a white 2001 Mazda Millenia with a "Obama for President" bumper sticker, honk your horn and I'll wave. Laughing out loud

Cheers,

Kevin "Hack" King


BPR's picture
Submitted by BPR on Wed, 02/20/2008 - 7:46pm.

How are you- I am doing fine- thanks for being my buddy.

______________________________
"Hope Changes Everything"


Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Mon, 02/18/2008 - 3:50am.

I can't find your email at the other site, and I really haven't had a lot of free time today. I'm still willing to email you.

As far as credibility, your saying that MS was lying when she correctly pointed out similarities between "Lilly" and BPR does damage your credibility. (Notice that few people take $ seriously because he uses multiple identities. That tends to make people question someone's sanity.)

You seem to spend a lot of time trying to convince me and others that you didn't do anything wrong and that everything's OK. Maybe it's because you know, deep down, that you'll have a hard time regaining credibility with the people here and are embarrassed by your actions.

"your ticket to sin" -- You might want to think about what you've done and how you responded when you were caught and the principle of restitution.


Submitted by sageadvice on Mon, 02/18/2008 - 5:10am.

You are still being gullible!
This person doesn't exist as she is presented.

Grace to you but I knowI'm ok. i want you to e-mail me when the band strikes up. ill here the email. i can't give you mine e-mail me though
i can not be harmed due to grace i had my feeling hurt but i cried. you will be unglad that all of you jump in me for Christian!
i get paid everday at the end of the month and by you! I have three jobs.
my most adorable and hansom husban said to stop and fotgit and i am goin to do it after i win. i will and can only win due to who is on my side always--swing low sweet chariot!
if my friens onhere will sit aroun me at cofee to pertect me good ill come to cofee and evalute you al.
im done now forever may have to come back to defend however.
im only concern about me and handsum husband and beautifl son who stays elsewher/.

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