My goodness John Munford! Are you an independent, objective news reporter or are you Mayor Logsdon’s personal spin doctor? Your comments are unresearched and unbelievable.

Someone called me on the phone saying you were trashing me on the Citizen web site and I could not believe my eyes when I read your comments. I went back to the Citizen archives and found that Frank Lynch covered the Target story for the newspaper which might account for your tilted perception and lack of knowledge on the subject.

For the recorded, I voted against the legal settlement with Faison (Target). For the record, I had previously opposed big box stores due to the negative impacts and I still maintain that position to this day. For the record, Faison’s claim to be able to build the Target was “vested rights” as the shopping center plan was approved in 1995 and the big box ordinance did not hit our books until 2000.

For the record, Peachtree Brokers (PCDC/Pathway) had a signed letter from my predecessor on city stationary stating they had vest rights to build a big box store on the site. For the record, a loop-hole in our ordinances (which I later had closed via ordinance): there was no termination date on site plans that were approved by the city (in other words, a shopping center design approved in 1960 was still valid in 2000 even if plans for the area had changed over time).

For the record, the site plan for phase two of the Kedron site showed a large rectangle designated as a big box. For the record, we fought with Fasion in court and we were joined by legal representation from the adjacent neighborhoods.

John Munford’s far-reaching-beyond-reality comparison between my actively objecting to the Target development and battling a legitimate vested rights lawsuit versus Mayor Logsdon’s OPEN EMBRACE of big box development and his hard push for its approval even though we have a big box ordinance is deceitful.

The adjacent homeowners, as an active legal partner knowing our situation with the Target litigation, thank us for doing everything in our power to protect them. On the other hand, the adjacent homeowners with the big box on Highway 74-S are furious at Mayor Logsdon for enabling the developer. The mayor is trying his best to bring in at least two more big boxes on key arterial roads (possibly two more). There is a huge difference.

You can and you should do better John Munford. As for McDonoughdawg, I remember you being a darn good trash talker during the last election. You were pretty good a bad mouthing me on this site, and you can keep on going for all I care. All I ask for is an honest discussion and for a free and open press.

From the Citizen:

“The North Carolina company was asking the court to establish its “vested rights” to build the 125,000 square-foot Target store and 145,000 square feet of additional commercial space in the final two phases of Kedron Village.

Faison insists it has a right to build Target at Kedron because a large-scale “big box” retailer was included in the original site plans for the commercial center when it was first laid out in the early 1990s.” (Citizen, March 10, 2004)

“Peachtree City Mayor Steve Brown has been an outspoken opponent of big box development. However, Brown stated, ‘This lawsuit was really more about the landowner’s vested rights from 1995 than our city’s ‘big box’ ordinance.’

Brown continued, ‘I applaud my three colleagues for coming to the table and going through the gut-wrenching process of trying to deliver the best outcome for our city. For me personally, the difference between a ‘yes’ vote and ‘no’ vote was 23,000 square feet, because our City Attorney stated at 192,000 square feet, I would have had no choice but to vote in favor of the development due to vested rights.’” (Citizen, April 2, 2004)

“That decision pleased members of the Lake Kedron Homeowners Association who had joined with the city to oppose Faison’s original site plan submitted more than a year ago. They mainly objected to plans to extend Regents Park into the Target parking lot.
Under the plans approved Friday morning, the current termination of Regents Park will be made a true dead-end and a stand of trees and vegetation will remain.

‘We want this process to move forward, which means we’re ready to see something built,’ said Lake Kedron officer John Hedge.” (Citizen, October 27, 2004)

John is nobody's spin doctor. I enjoy reading his artlicles and find them accurate and insightful. The headlines are another matter! That's where Cal does his "spinning."

You are one touchy person, and that may be the reason you lost big time. Sorry to be so blunt, but it gets old, you acting like your were PERFECT in office.

Fact is, you voted for things that were in direct conflict to the land use plan.

One of those things in direct conflict wouldn't have been the Lutheran church-into-a-CVS re-zoning would it? Even Rapson and Weed wouldn't go for that one.

NUK

Very defensive, an answer for everything, never admit wrongdoing or even an error in judgment. Very self-centered and you are correct that is a big part of why he didn't get elected again - that and God's will.

On the specific subject - Target - he did vote against the land use plan and it was up to the rest of the council to vote the other way and get the job done properly, legally and in the best interest of the citizens of Peachtree City. If Rapson and Weed had been there, the vote would have gone the other way and the lawsuit will still be going on. You know how those lawsuits end, don't you? Developer wins and gets general commercial zoning without any restrictions the city could have negotiated. Just ask Tyrone.

So on Target like almost everything else, Brown is out there by himself trying to get publicity instead of working for compromise. He lacks leadership and everyday common sense negotiating skills - that's the other reason he wasn't elected - we wanted leadership from an adult.

Now, he will respond by citing all the bad things others have done completely ignoring the central point of this post - Steve Brown lacks leadership skills.

So, do you like my new picture? meow

Dearest Mudcat,

Don't like your new pic. Problem is you sound too much like her these days.

As far as me being perfect I say thanks for the compliment. I'd say I'm not perfect but secure in the truth that the facts make me right on these issues 99% of the time. I may have a big head and possum eating grin but it's only because I relish tormenting cats while they are always trying to cover up their crap in litter box.

Go ahead. Take your next shot. It's obvious I can take a punch from the worst of you guys. I'm kind of like Superman aren't I. It's killing you isn't it. You just can't find a way to take me down and discredit me. So go ahead Honey and witch slap me again. I likes it.

With All My Love,

Steve

________

"That man was Griffin Judicial Circuit District Attorney Scott Ballard".

CLICK HERE FOR THE REST OF THE STORY

Let me get this straight, Steve. You felt strongly enough to vote against Faison/Target but you couldn't convince your fellow council members to do the same?

Yet somehow the tennis center lawsuit was STILL active at the close of your administration. Those legal fees (in the six figures if I recall correctly) would've been better spent fighting Target/Faison.

Certainly council could've put up some kind of defense that that Target plan (submitted in '03 or '04?) wasn't anywhere NEAR the 1995 so-called big box plan that preceded it.

As for your accusation about me being a Logsdon shill, YOU KNOW BETTER. I've praised you before for doing the right thing, and I've chided you for the wrong thing (i.e. your Walgreen's/Christ Our Shepherd vote which was AGAINST the land use plan).

If Logsdon and co. approve big boxes, you can bet they'll take the heat from the citizenry, and I'll report it. But until then, the score is:

Brown and Co: 1, Logsdon and co: ZERO.

Kind of like in baseball, Steve. A run doesn't count until the runner successfully touches first, second, third and home in order. The Big Box developers haven't scored yet on the Logsdon bunch.

Alright John Munford, you have to put both oars in the water to get to the other side.

First you say, “You felt strongly enough to vote against Faison/Target but you couldn't convince your fellow council members to do the same?” Then you say, “I've chided you for the wrong thing (i.e. your Walgreen's/Christ Our Shepherd vote which was AGAINST the land use plan).” Both were 4-1 votes. Are you saying you can “feel” my conviction on each one and that they are some how different?

Is that anything like the “vibe” you are getting from Steve Boone (your previous post)?

The Lutheran vote was not against the land use planning criteria set forth in our plans. It was unpopular, but the land was clearly in the village center, you cannot deny that.

You did not read the quotes I included from the newspaper. The old site plan (later became Target) called for 192,000 square feet. They had a letter from Bob Lenox saying they had vested rights. Do you think you could have won that case? The homeowners associations’ attorney told them they got a good deal and their leadership agreed. They had the same legal briefs and case law that we did.

Let me give you a better sport analogy: I was trying to sack the big box for a loss and Mayor Logsdon is trying to get them over the goal line for a score. There is a big difference between actively pursing big boxes and trying to fight one off. You avoided that point completely in your response.

I cannot believe you made the tennis center remark as you covered that toward the end. Judge English held the proceedings until January 2006, wonder why? We did not drop the lawsuit, the Logsdon council did. All of the capital expenses accounted to Development Authority, by the authority members, only amounted to a little over $500,000 and those were paid for with hotel/motel tax dollars. The illegal debt totaled $1.5 million. Where did all that money go - no one knows. With debt service charges included, the Peachtree City taxpayers are shelling out a little over $1.4 million. When you cut the employees compensation and pay someone’s illegal debt that does not belong to us, it is not hard to figure out why the employee outlook is low.

I remember a John Munford who refused to believe anything wrong happened with the Development Authority until the Vice Chairman confirmed what I was saying. Even Doug Warner admitted to you, later, that things were not done according to state law.

They said I was crazy with my TDK comments. They said I did not know what I was talking about when I said the SPLOST model was way-off base. They sued, they arrested and they filed ethics charges to make me back down. I think reality has set in and all of their intentions are pretty clear in the public's eye now.

McDonoughdawg must have an inferiority complex. I never claimed to be perfect; however, I was honest and open on those issues. I am certainly glad to go through some of the posts and see McDonoughdawg agrees with me on TDK.

Keep the debate raging.

I'm not sure if you know the rules or not here. You can't say ANYTHING bad about Brown. You can't even hint of it.

You're right, the parking lot at Target is atrocious in its look. It looks like something I would see near my Sisters home in Forsyth County. Federal rules or not, it could have been made more presentable. Look at the Avenue for the answer.

The current administration is far from perfect, but they have done two major things that they said they would do when they ran. Clear up the Tennis Center Debt, and work with Wieland and Levitt on the annexation and McDuff extension.

Keep up the good work, John. I appreciate your efforts.

This is hilarious!!! John Munford is trying to beat his way out of his paper bag. All of my neighbors were ecstatic to have Steve Brown fighting on our side against the Target developer. He and Steve Rapson beat the fool out of them.

TDK was no different. Oh yeah, everyone hates TDK now but no one would listen to Brown before. The guy is just like Winston Churchill when he kept telling everyone to act against Hitler and they laughed at him. No one is laughing any more.

I thought the target center mess was approved by lenox and his band of scoundrels before they left office?
Steve was trying to fight the size once he took office. Target and company said they had already been promised and a contract had been signed. Is my memory failing? You have better access to the archives here than I do. Who was really at fault for that ugly blight on the north side?

Chief Murray is a wealth of knowledge.

All you have to do is ask him and he has the numbers.

I'm loking forward to the CC meeting on the Lowe's.

Da Mayor, CC and Mr. Lidsey, (sp), will have a hard row to hoe with that one.

SB was no saint, I'll grant you but when was the land zoned "GC"?

The city had no option but to allow the Target to come in as it was grandfathered. Fighting it would have cost PTC $100,000's of dollars and would have resulted in us having to pay the lawyers.

That the folks on the north side took the initiative to assist in the design of it's access points was a good thing.

Just a farce to pretend to oppose these discount stores (by the council). They want the income for head count building.
Remember when Walmart wanted to build at Kedron?
They said NO! Wrong person owned the land,,,,no, I mean, not now.

After all, Pathway's only real argument was they had dropped the non-descript site plan.

Don'tcha think SB and company could've reined in the parking spaces a bit though? That's one asphalt jungle for sure. Uck!

Wonder how many regular Joes and Janes look at that development as a Pathway 'sellout'

The Target center was preordained as one of the original commercial "nodes" -- everybody and their brother knew something big would be there at some point. Only the details and timing were at issue.

No, it's not Avenue pretty, but at least you can buy something in that center without taking out a second mortgage. Plus you can actually get to it in a golf cart. And it's still easier to use and less impactful than the WalMart-Home Depot mess, in my opinion.

Now let's look at annexation to finish carpeting the westside with dense development. What part of the plan was that? When was there ever a rational, coherent argument made for the benefits of annexation, beyond the self-interests of a couple hundred westside residents and the developers, coupled with some vague concern that Tyrone might do something someday? (Interesting that Tyrone opposed on the grounds it will be too dense.)

I hope the westsiders enjoy seeing all those Cowetans blow through on the fabulous new Mcduff Parkway every morning and evening. Talk about your Pyrrhic victories....

Based on the coverage I've read in your paper, the fact that the Lowe's deal may not fly is a result of citizen outcry that has finally become too loud for the council to ignore.

"The Target center was preordained as one of the original commercial "nodes" -- everybody and their brother knew something big would be there at some point. Only the details and timing were at issue."

You're overestimating the intelligence and common-sense of a LOT of people here. You are dead-on right that the land was always going to be big commercial, but a lot of residents have never thought about anything in PTC that happened before they bought their home. They assumed they would be the last homeowners allowed to build a house in Kedron and that no shopping or anything else would ever happen. Why anyone could be this dumb is beyond me, but that's the mentality you deal with in PTC all the time. Move in and close the door behind you to anything else.

NUK

If you don't like the attitude of people in PTC, why not move to a crime city that is always ready to develop? They love developers and strip malls ......sounds like it is right up your alley. Take the alley cat/mudcat with you. What about henry county for you?? They love overcrowding too!

You would love it there, they always assume more people are moving in.

The majority of PTC residents seem to be pretty happy folks. The shrill malcontents who seem to hate everything are a minority of the population, especially of the voting population.

NUK

Believe it or not there is a formula for determining the number of parking spaces that is based on the total sq ft of retail space. The city has no voice in determining that.

David Rast caught that with the proposed Lowe's development.

The Group VI office building on 74 and Redwine. There was never a septic plan for that property. the developer was counting on the city to annex that property so they could hookup to city water/sewer.

Yeah I must've forgot because it hasn't hurt PTC one bit!

I feel pretty safe with this statement. Most, if not close to ALL, people in PTC don't care about that tiny annexation because it doesn't affect them.

How's that for ya?

And 'bout the parking. If memory serves the parking space ordinance came AFTER Target et al and not before. You can spout formulas all you want but that thing is still ugly.

Were I a PTC resident I'd have fumed about big spending on the Tennis Center lawsuit instead of the Big Box suit.

SB and Co. picked their battles, but obviously the wrong one as the TC is still there under the city's umbrella no matter how you slice it. And the future Target gas station (or is it Target Carmax?) is waiting to be plopped down in the sea of asphalt in Kedron PH3. Ugh.

The development at Redwine and 74 is a non revenue generator.

That means that it will cost the city more than it receives in taxes to support it.

Come to think of it, private homes are the same way.

Ask DR.

Annexing a negative revenue generating property is not the way to balance the budget.

Even if it was a break even project, the developer had no plans for a septic system.

I'm left to wonder how they new it would be annexed.

Parking is at a state or Fed. level I think.

I agree with McDonoughDawg that the annexation is not the last nail in the coffin for Peachtree City. However, I agree with Johenry that more big boxes and the TDK traffic will about finish off the wonderful city we have known for some time.

Hey, Peachtree City will probably be better than most, but it will not resemble what we have appreciated for so long. Logsdon's build it like any other city philosophy is the worst thing to ever hit us.

There are a lot of homes for sale right now.

"I'm NOT John Munford"