City mulls over adding more firefighters

Thu, 03/30/2006 - 5:52pm
By: Ben Nelms

When it comes to providing current firefighting service to Peachtree City residents, the option of incrementally adding several firefighters per shift seems to outweigh the possibility of adding a fifth station and relocating northside Station 84.

Responding to what appeared to be a relative consensus at the City Council retreat March 25, City Manager Bernie McMullen said the emphasis was on increasing staffing without increasing the millage rate.

Laying out a strategic plan for the Fire Department, Chief Stony Lohr told council members the plan offers improvements that will enable continued provision of high quality emergency fire, medical and rescue services for the community and provides increased safety for emergency responders in a cost effective manner. The goal, said Lohr, is to incorporate the department’s plan into the city’s overall strategic plan.

Lohr said the Fire Department currently operates four fire stations staffed by 46 career firefighters and two administrative staff. The department staffs three shifts with 13 career or part-time firefighters per shift. The department also operates with 64 volunteer firefighters, of whom 32 live in Peachtree City.

Lohr raised questions relating to the direction the city might take in meeting fire fighting needs now and in the future. Within that framework, four basic questions emerged. Those included the potential relocation of Station 84, adding a fifth fire station, a reckoning of how Peachtree City compares with cities of similar size and the number of firefighters required to fight a residential fire.

A less than adequate number of firefighters per shift is the department’s weakest link, Lohr said.

Council members discussed at length the possibility of relocating Station 84 on the city’s northside if the West Village annexation occurs or opening a fifth station either on Ga. Highway 74 South or on the north side near the West Village area.

After much discussion the consensus that prevailed, in terms of overall benefit to the community, was to look at adding a combination of four career and part-time firefighters per shift, for a total of 12, within the next three to five years at a cost of $662,080 per year.

Those additions, said Lohr, would provide two firefighters per vehicle, thus enhancing the department’s overall ability to adequately and properly respond to fire emergencies.

Another option, that of hiring six firefighters per shift, would cost $993,120 annually.

Either way, meeting current needs and adequately addressing the service needs of the upcoming addition of nearly one million square feet of new permitted development makes the need to hire needed firefighters even more pertinent, he said.

During an assessment of the merits of relocating Station 84, adding a fifth fire station or increasing the number of firefighters, it became clear that adding to the number of firefighters was the current priority.

When factored for critical benefits to the community, adding four firefighters per shift over time was projected to improve initial response time and en route safety and reduce the time required to enter a building to fight fires or perform rescues. Those factors had only limited benefit when applied to adding a fifth station and either limited benefit or no benefit when applied to relocating Station 84.

“We can’t do it all at one time, but we need to do what we can when we can,” said Mayor Harold Logsdon, mirroring the sentiment of council members who voiced a similar posture in terms of increasing the numbers of firefighters to address current and future public safety needs.

Compared to Peachtree City’s population of 33,810, the cites of Dalton and Alpharetta, with populations of 31,478 and 34,245, respectively, are staffed by a significantly larger number of firefighters.

Peachtree City has an ISO insurance rating of 4 compared to Dalton’s current ISO 2 rating. Dalton also has five fire stations with 27 firefighters per shift. Alpharetta, currently building a fifth fire station, has 25 firefighters per shift and an ISO rating of 3. Fire insurance premiums paid by homeowners generally decrease with a lower ISO rating.

Addressing the question of whether Peachtree City should maintain its current mutual aid agreement with Fayette County or move to a more time and labor intensive automatic aid agreement, the consensus held that the existing mutual aid arrangement would be the best course.

Peachtree City firefighting apparatus currently includes three engines, one Quint, one tower and one reserve engine and one heavy rescue unit. The department also operates three primary ambulances and one reserve unit.

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Submitted by annoyed2max on Wed, 04/05/2006 - 1:46pm.

Fayette County needs to hire more 911 dispatchers if there are considerations of hiring more emergency personnel.

Submitted by Sailon on Fri, 03/31/2006 - 1:54pm.

A 25% head count increase in firefighters may be needed, but why? Do we need so many fire stations? Seems to me that that is what causes not enough people per station to man the equipment. 13 people spread out over four is not enough, obviously. Also 7 people are unaccounted for in the difference between the 39 identified and the 46 career fighters enumerated. Are they desk fighters (supervisors)? Try three stations, north, south, middle, and use everyone, and you will have 15 per station, and a Chief. Also, do a sincere volunteer program, we don't really need to keep adding unlimited cops (8 more wanted) and firefighters for an occasional fire. An ambulance to a car wreck should suffice and then they can call others if needed. Use Zero base budgeting for a change. What Dalton and others do doesn't mean squat. Yes. I want at least one to come to my house if it is on fire.

Submitted by intheknow on Fri, 03/31/2006 - 4:58pm.

25% may sound like alot, if you want to know why, stop by one of the city fire stations and ask questions for yourself. A brief history: the city grew, an administration in place for years failed to add personnel when it should have (even when asked several times by council), call volume, tasks and responsibilities dramatically increased. Basically the department staffing of the Fire, Police and Public Works DIDN"T keep pace with the city's growth.
You are correct on unaccounted staffing numbers, i.e. 39 on shift (three 24 hour shift's staffed by 13 personnel) and seven staff positions i.e. Chief, Assistant Chief, Fire Marshall, Assistant Fire Marshall, EMS Lieutenant, Training Captain, Training Lieutenant.
Cutting down to three, the number of stations would first - increase response times (time it takes to get to your house), And your math of "15" per station in your senerio would only occur if the city hired 96 additional firefighters at an approximaite cost of $5,750,000.00 - Guess your math is off, You don't get 15 per station anyway you do it, unless you've got some really neat calculator (three - 24 hour shifts - you figure it out)
Your statement you want "one to come by your house if it's on fire". Sure, we'll go with your plan, we'll send one by, say one of the engines dailey staffed with only one person. You can stand in the street with that one firefighter on his one engine and watch your house burn to the ground. Through task analysis, the most basic small residential structure fire requires 18-21 firefighters to extinguish.
And whats your "zero base budgeting", is that don't pay for any services and don't get any services in return? Everything comes at a price, if you don't want to be protected, that's your business. Many people seem to whine alot about thier Peachtree City taxes, put it in perspective. Unincorporated Fayette County residents pay almost as much JUST for thier fire tax (not EMS), as Peachtree City residents pay for Fire ,EMS, Police, Public Works, Recreation, Library, etc... What a great deal!
Ignorance is bliss - you must be ecstatic

Submitted by Sailon on Fri, 03/31/2006 - 5:11pm.

Fifteen per station for THREE shifts, plus volunteers, equals 5 per station plus volunters. I realize that everyone involved with jobs paid by taxes try to make the jobs sound so complicated to manage that us ignorants need to go to the fire station for brain washing, but we don't. That is the standard line "go to the fire station."

Submitted by Reality Bytes on Fri, 03/31/2006 - 5:57pm.

Just want to make sure that intheknow and idontknow aren't considered to be one and the same person.....but....

Highgreen - you have really got to have some massive case of cranial-rectal inversion syndrome.

There are 35,000 residents in Peachtree City. At about 3 people per house, that's about 11,600 residences. There is a fairly bustling industrial park, an airport and recreation that ebbs and flows additional people into the City.

Let's say there's a car accident in "the south part of the City" - we'll just go with the Wilshire area. Someone calls it in, but doesn't say it has injuries, but three people are injured and have to go the hospital. About five minutes later, there is a car accident in "the center part of the City" - 54 and Peachtree Parkway. Meanwhile, up the road at the Piedmont Medical Center on Shakerag Hill, a child has an allergic reaction to something and stops breathing. Ten minutes later, an older house in Wynnmeade catches on fire. An hour later, on the "north side of town", there's a gas leak at the elementary school. Oh yeah, and a fire alarm was activated at Panasonic. All in the course of an hour.

Hey, and when do they test the hydrants to make sure they work, or inspect a building to make sure that their not stacking boxes up against the exit doors?

Don't believe that happens? Go by one of the stations and ask a firefighter. That is, if they're there.

It's like insurance. You don't really want to pay the premiums, but when you need it, it's the most important thing in the world.

Quit whining - your taxes are going up this year. If you don't like it, move.

Submitted by Sailon on Fri, 03/31/2006 - 7:16pm.

I think you don't think. You can't understand numbers when they get into three shifts, etc. What if Iran attacked Israel tomorrow and at the same time Syria moved into Iraq, and at the same time North Korea moved into South Korea, and the Chinese invaded Taiwan. Man we need 50 million soldiers and enough bombs to fill Mexico three feet deep!!!! I give up on you, you'r evidently prejudiced for some reason on this matter.

Submitted by Reality Bytes on Fri, 03/31/2006 - 8:21pm.

Uh-oh...

Dear highgreen (Mr. or Mrs. Jones) - I'd like to make sure that appropriate staffing levels are maintained to make sure that when a family member has a medical condition they will get to the hospital with a fighting chance to live. So I guess, yeah, I'm prejudiced.

I think you just don't read. Have you reviewed the information provided at the Council retreat? Did you even go to the Council retreat? If not, why not? Have you even considered what the national standards are for staffing levels?

For cities the same size and population as Peachtree City, there are substantially more fire stations, more firefighters, more police and LESS services provided for the tax dollar than what are provided in Peachtree City! You don't really understand what you get for your dollar at all, do you?

Three shifts, by the way, would equal three times the staffing. So if they were to ask for 15 firefighters, they are actually asking for 5. For four stations, that's one per station and one extra. But that's not what's being recommended, if you were to have read the retreat agenda packet.

You may wish to get your information from sources a bit more comprehensive than a 1000 word "report" from a local newspaper. If you were truly interested, I bet you could actually get the information you would need to make an informed decision. But instead, you login with your oddball conspiracy theories and your hackneyed views on municipal planning.

Your opinion is uninformed, unimportant and often unintelligble. Do us all a favor and go the way of the former mayor...AWAY.

City Council is 1st and 3rd Thursdays, 151 Willowbend Road, right next to the library. If you care so much, show up. If not, shut up.

I'd love to know what you do for a living, so I can make sure not to go anywhere near that business....

Submitted by Sailon on Sat, 04/01/2006 - 6:27am.

By the way, are you Mr. or Mrs. Jones, or what?? You are obviously prejudiced and have no open mind when spending taxpayers money. It doesn't hurt to ask questions and expect answers without being brainwashed by more people wanting on the dole. Defame those asking questions---the Bush way.

cmc865's picture
Submitted by cmc865 on Sat, 04/01/2006 - 7:01pm.

Highgreen, You are absolutely entitled to ask questions and expect answers, however do not be so closed minded when the answers you get are not what you want to hear. You call it brainwashing, I and others call it facts. Not made up by us and the city, however national standards and facts you yourself can verify through any number of organizations such as the Gerorgia Municipal Association, National Fire Protection Association, National League of Cities, National Association of County Managers. Not brainwashing, just facts, FACTS you dont want to hear.
Yes I am biased when it comes to this matter, I am a fire officer here in the city. I am also a citizen of this city too. My opinion is shared by many other citizens and for the last fifteen years of talking to the citizens you are very much in the minority. This is America and your opinion matters, lets put it to a vote and see how it turns out. Again I am prejudiced for one reason, give me the resources to do my job, that job is saving yours when you need me. More importantly ensuring that my fellow employees go home alive after each shift.


Submitted by dopplerobserver on Sat, 04/01/2006 - 7:35pm.

I believe the discussion is over due to prejudice. All those supporting orgnizations you listed are also prejudiced organizations. We simply shouldn't man or spend according to generated numbers but only according to need and ability to pay. You didn't answer, what is the Jones stuff you said to highgreen? Are you people going the route of spying or something to get your career assured? Do all of the seven officers work the day shift? If not, how many do? I didn't see that answer. It seems all important facts are always left out. You should have what you must have--no more. Ask some Delta people if they want higher taxes.

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