I have read most of the posts over the last week or so regarding SB458 and have been shocked at the pace with which we are all ready to throw our dedicated elected officials and friends into the fire. I am all for holding them to high standards and expecting them to do what's best for our community but when you get down to it everyone is human.

Cut to the chase, folks made an unintentional mistake that *MAY* have POSSIBLY had some negative impacts for our school district (the validity of those claims is seriously questionable given that the last word would still lie with the local School Board). As Sen. Chance says, he is not a lawyer and to be honest neither are many of you. If some of you are lawyers you practice a totally different brand of law than what is practiced in the chambers. Yes, its true, our Legislators are human and makes mistakes...is that a sin or is the response he makes to the mistake what really matters? Let's take stock of the fact that the issue was resolved and fixed within a week and never even close to passing into law. Let's maybe be glad that our State Senator is fairly powerful within the chamber and has the connections to make that fix so rapidly. Yes, it took some outside influence to get there, but isn't that the hallmark of democratic government? Responsive representation?

I think those of you, which is to say most of you, who call yourselves pious Christians would have to be blind to your faith to question these folks very core for erring momentarily. Aren't we supposed to forgive, particularly when the errant party has so rapidly and publicly fixed as well as atoned for his *purported* error? No, that wouldn't sell newspapers or online ads for Ford dealers and restaurants so why deal in that at all? In reality what you have all become a part of is a witch hunt orchestrated by ill-informed and inflammatory individuals who have little respect for the community and even less for the truth. You are but pawns in the hands of fear mongering school administrators and political novices grinding their axes against those who have stepped up to lead.

You want to get into the REAL ISSUE HERE? Maybe we should lay down the pitchforks of limited government demagoguery and think about supporting the legislators we elect with proper staffs and compensation. They do important work, crucially important in fact, and maybe they should have help and a full-time job to accomplish that task effectively. Yes, it is a privilege to be a State legislator, but is it one that should be off-limits to anyone who has to earn a livelihood and support their family? Realize that these people have no staff provided by the State, have three months a year to learn this job, are paid less than their expenses for their efforts and are constantly bombarded with requests, letters, lobbyists, collegial demands, phone calls, bills/research to read, meetings to attend, community events to marshal and all that jazz. Sure, it sounds great to you desk jockey amateur political experts, but try being a perfect legislator when you are working 50-60 hours/week (supposedly PART TIME) in Atlanta while maintaining your regular job (because you're losing real money being in the legislature) and staying close with your family and community. The honest answer is very few of these guys and gals are able to, or even try to, accomplish that. They throw out their family, their constituents, and their legislative responsibilities to party it up with lobbyists at free dinners and booze parties for three months. Maybe it would be worth you all checking into lobbyist expenditure reports to see that your State Senator is almost never out to dinner on their dime and rather returns home to the District and his family every night. Maybe you ought to consider the role that power and seniority play in the Senate and realize that your State Senator is among leadership. Maybe take a minute to meet the man and see that he does yeoman's work every day for us. Sure, he's not perfect, but YOU AREN'T EITHER don't kid yourself.

How silly of me to think that the citizens of this County, who are among the best educated model citizens of our great State would step back to think twice before burning their representative and friend at the stake. Realize that there are very few good men and women in your government, and somehow you have found one of them to tar and feather over a "mistake" that was completely reversed. I, for one, am still voting Republican, and still voting Chance.

Be informed not manipulated.

Who was the comedian that always talked in third person? Jimmy is this and Jimmy is that.

Now Ronnie. Thanks for the long winded defense of your inability to comprehend and perform the task in which you were sent up there to perform. Many who know you understand the fact that you make for a good figurehead like your mentor Wastemoreland. But apart from appearances, we also know that labeling you as mediocre performer is being generous and dubbing you an intellectual lite weight is being honest. Many a candidate was dupped by your self proclaimed expertise at running an election as they were left holding the bag after wasting thousands of dollars for your useless cookie cutter consulting. And then there is your less than stellar leadership as the GOP chair.

Now as to your admission that you are not a lawyer and not bright enough to study the bills out and think for yourself; I find it un-nerving that my state senator ranks lower than an attorney in overall integrity and trustworthiness. Yup, a political consultant and a former lobbyist is the only thing worse than having a pack of career litigators (no offense Richard H) running this country. And you are both of those. Yikes!

And then you come on here accusing your critics of being "pious Christians" for not forgiving you for being so irresponsible with the trust that was placed in you. Shame on you. Do you not have enough sense to understand that your duties and responsibilities along with your failure to truly grasp the effects your decisions make on We The People? The often times irreversible damage your careless lawmaking can create? And you cavalierly insist that we forgive you for a supposed oversight in a job that has no margin for error regarding your careless and damaging bad decisions. Boy, let me tell you this: If you cannot properly legislate and comprehend the importance of the task in which you were elected to perform, then it's high time you pack it up and return home to some sort of useful career.

And then you whine and moan that you don't have a staff to do the work you volunteered to perform? Did it ever occur to you that perhaps this state might be better served with you guys concentrating on a few major projects each year so that you totally understand the consequences of your actions? Do you not understand that every time you clowns meet, It costs the businesses of Georgia tremendous resources and time trying to adjust and comply to your 'feel good whims' that your are told how to vote on?

Do us all a favor Ronny. Instead of running full speed a head with your nose just inches from Silly Purdue's backside, why don't you draft some useful legislation that will truly protect the citizens of Georgia. For starters the first one would be that our state reps meet once every 4 years for 6 months out of the year. And no laws are to be passed by any legislator until they make an "A" on the exam that tests them on their knowledge of the bills in which you guys are trying to cram down our throats.

Now thanks for the lessons on how corrupt government takes place. You guys learned well from your Democrat predecessors. Heck you follow one that only changed parties because it was the only way he could get elected.

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

You're smarter than everyone, you figured it all out, you're a modern day sherlock. On top of all that you're respectful, understanding, deliberative, original, and a giant among men. It would be impossible for you to ever be hypocritical or obvious or redundant or inflammatory, slanderous, ill-informed or an overall blowhard.

It is incredibly hard for me to conceive of how the three of you who continually comment on this site under 15 screen names haven't found something better to do with your lives. (I realize I am being hypocritical here, but that's just the status quo apparently). Let's take a look at the severity of this situation....has anything bad happened to anyone? Was any money misappropriated or cut from a budget? Was there a moral lapse, infidelity or indulgence perhaps? Was Fayette County disadvantaged in any way? The FINAL AND ONLY REAL answer is NO. THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS WORKED, what a tragedy that is. Let's all put on our big boy pants and get a grip.

You're smarter than everyone, you figured it all out, you're a modern day sherlock. On top of all that you're respectful, understanding, deliberative, original, and a giant among men. It would be impossible for you to ever be hypocritical or obvious or redundant or inflammatory, slanderous, ill-informed or an overall blowhard.

It's about time I got the recognition around here that I deserve. Thank you, thank you, thank you! This is exactly what I've been trying to convince Cy, Hutch and Cal Beverly of for months now. Do you think you could convince Silly Purdue and company to award me some sort of plaque or something.

Let's take a look at the severity of this situation....has anything bad happened to anyone?

You scare me with that kind of thinking. Does that mean that if I'm ever pulled over for being intoxicated (Mein Stream Minded), all I have to do is claim that irresponsibility, carelessness and total disregard for those around doesn't matter because "NOTHING BAD HAPPENED" and nobody got hurt? Freaky thinking there for someone who is defending a so-called self proclaimed "personal responsibility conservative".

THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS WORKED

Are you really that stupid? The legislative process didn't work. WE THE PEOPLE WORKED! If it wouldn't have been for "WE THE PEOPLE" this harmful and typical knee jerk law would have been crammed down our throats.

Look you clueless twit. WE THE PEOPLE put you GOP hacks in power to change the way government operated in this state and what did you re-hashed recycled former Democrats do? Nothing.... everything pretty much remains the same. Shame on you!

NOW FOR AN IMPORTANT SIDE NOTE: Hack, Sniffles, Main Stream and Yardguy...... If you EVER want any recognition of credibility from many of "my kind" then might I suggest you start holding your pack of weasels to the same critical bi-partisan standards as many us do who sit not in your camp. Remember that being a Democrat in no way exempts or excuses the bad behavior and lack of integrity that permeates the donkey party.

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

"NOW FOR AN IMPORTANT SIDE NOTE: Hack, Sniffles, Main Stream and Yardguy...... If you EVER want any recognition of credibility from many of "my kind" then might I suggest you start holding your pack of weasels to the same critical bi-partisan standards as many us do who sit not in your camp."

Let's talk about CREDIBILITY, Git. You, as a wealthy, conservative republicanish guy, tried to convince us all two weeks ago that there is no recession, just a "tough spot." credible?

You explained that in Iraq we are fighting for the "secular Muslems?"

credible?

You explained how Rev. Wright preaches a hate-filled message and then you explained how "all Muslems" through their hate-filled book, are ALL EVIL. (Fight hate with hate, Git?) Now, I believe we have several local Muslem citizens and military members and U.S. allies who beg to differ with you.

Frankly, Git, complaints from republicans about "hypocrisy," a "liberal media," "hateful liberals," "cluless liberals," "finacially irresponsible liberals" are NOT CREDIBLE.

You seem to be frustrated because all of your "conservatives*", from the president to the local Georgia Reps, are disappointing you. Do you think, Git, that the entire principle of conservative fiscal policy may not be viable? That may be THE ANSWER, Git. These men may not be closet democrats. They may realize that cutting taxes is not raising revenue through business profit trickle down. They may realize they can't destroy the department of education and IRS, because we actually need REVENUE and EDUCATION.

Don't draw me into your attempt to re brand your republicans as democrats. The GOP is running Georgia, Fayette County, PTC, and the USA. When we take over at any of those levels, I'll "hold my end accountable." For now, your votes have enabled this mess (from Iraq to school vouchers.) Deal with it like a man, brother. Admit that. And try to help them craft viable conservative policies (insulting them may not help your case). But this is your family business, not us dems.

I want my old Git Back

Cheers, and I still think you are one hell of a guy (just wrong here)

Kevin "Hack" King

Let's talk about CREDIBILITY, Git. You, as a wealthy, conservative republicanish guy, tried to convince us all two weeks ago that there is no recession, just a "tough spot." credible?

Sooo . . let's go get a guy off the street, who has never built a business,never met a payroll,never had a management position in a company, and never felt his salary or benefits cut by economic cycles.

Yeah Hack that'd be a real expert wouldn't it???

Somebody like Git is the perfect person to ask about the economy.

Unless you can tell me you honestly have ever worried about your military or Delta health benefits being reduced because of the company's economic struggles OR how you spend some off time figuring how to work harder and make your company more profit so they could pay you more or not shave benefits-- you are (and I quote) NOT CREDIBLE.

Have a nice day.

BTW-Just curious- Do all Dems think money just magically appears awaiting to be distributed from those who earn it to those who don't?

say that you are.... No I don't! I'll say this: YOUR WORDS are idiotic, my friend.

"Unless you can tell me you honestly have ever worried about your military or Delta health benefits being reduced because of the company's economic struggles OR how you spend some off time figuring how to work harder and make your company more profit so they could pay you more or not shave benefits-- you are (and I quote) NOT CREDIBLE."

Mr. or Mrs. Sage, how many airlines went out of business this week? Good Lord you are blind as your average republican to the future 81% of us see as bleak!

Sun Country (layoffs)

Champion: Done! kaput!

ATA: History!

Skybus: DEAD!

Aloha Airlines? ALOHA!!!!

You, my three lettered friend, feel this:

"Somebody like Git is the perfect person to ask about the economy."

How about this off of the AP wire T O D A Y:

"Biggest Job Loss in 5 Years Sets Off Recession Alarms; Nearly Quarter-Million Gone in 3 Months"

SDG, are YOU telling US there is NO recession comming or here now? Really????

Why are REPUBLICANS LIKE YOU always the last to see reality when it comes?

Go start a blog on the myth of global warning, and explain how stoopid librals are!!

Kevin "Hack" King

ps: Git called this a tough or rough spot. I call it a recession. Who's right SDG?

Frontier Airlines chapter 11.

GE record losses in stock value.

Have you ever heard, "How GE/ GM goes, so goes the economy?"

Do you STILL think small business men who deny there is a recession here now or rapidly approaching are the "go to guys?"

Just curious; what is your background? You remind me of an old friend penta p.

Kevin "Hack" King

Frontier Airlines chapter 11.

I know this is a new concept, but ask yourself why did they go Chp 11?

Do you STILL think small business men who deny there is a recession here now or rapidly approaching are the "go to guys?"

Who in the world are you talking about?? I said that someone who DAILY deals with sales,banking,cash flow,employees,hiring, etc. is much more qualified to judge the ecomony than someone who doesn't.

I would have to look back but I believe my own comment was that times are hard in many segments of the economy and in some cases certain industies made very poor decisions that were a major cause of their present distress.

BTW-Which definition of recession are you using?

Just curious; what is your background? You remind me of an old friend penta p.

I'll take that a compliment and thank you for it. I'm not the penguin, but do enjoy his posts.

I've met him and I like him. I just wonder where he went.

So much name changing around here one never knows.

Are there multiple definitions of recession?

Lack of economic growth; I don't care if someone manages the GAO for a living. If they try to defend the current administration's fiscal policies by downplaying our current situation, I do not see how they can be a credible source of info. I would call them a biased source of info. Fork back in this circular waltz?

Kevin "Hack" King

If so, the chart I posted will be of special interest to you.

Ireland is recognized as one of the top 4-5 economies in the world. As such, the chart shows that their GNP is so robust that taxes are less than 4% of the total Gross National Product.

Interestingly, their top corporate rate of less than 15% is one of the lowest in the world.

Hmmm. . . low taxes and good economy makes you think, no?

Are there multiple definitions of recession?

Yes there are. I believe the current GAO definition is x number of quarters that show a decline in GNP.

BTW-I fail to see in any of this back and forth where I'm defending anything this Administration does economically.

I'll need Muddle's help on this, but I'm sure there a Latin debate term Ad MisquoteoumSDGis or something like that.

If you can avoid not consistently mischaracterizing my statements we can get a lot closer to common ground.

That pretty much sent me into orbit.

Kevin "Hack" King

But it's OK for you and your gang to LIE about me? I NEVER called your brother a wharf rat. NEVER. Not close. I tried to explain, but you won't listen. You'd rather lie. "That pretty much sent me into orbit."

Then to demand details about my personal life and to taunt me with "fetus flushing expert with a coat hanger." "That pretty much sent me into orbit."

If you lived 150 years ago, would you mock an abolitionist, even if that person had previously owned slaves? If you lived in Holland during the 1940s, would you have mocked the Dutch people who rescued Jews and others from extermination, even if they had looked the other way at first? Even if you yourself could not understand why someone would bother?

Could you ever open your hardened heart to consider that there are those who feel just as strongly about protecting the lives of pre-born children and the infirm such as your brother? I value those children as much as any other child and hopefully would never harden my heart to anyone who's sick and really needs help. Including women who are facing an unplanned pregnancy and desperately needing someone to assure them that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. That there is help. That there can be joy even in the midst of sorrow. If you don't understand that, that's OK. But why would you want to deny a mother knowing her child, even if she gives him to others to raise? What sacrifice. To spout empty platitudes about making abortion rare but doing nothing to save one child, and then to discourage, even vilify, those who are willing to try, THAT definitely sends me into orbit. My "mute" button's reset now.

“Women who are experiencing an unplanned pregnancy also deserve unplanned joy.” (Feminists for Life)

Denise, I think it was totally inappropriate to ask you if you ever had an abortion. That was Sniffles originally, as I recall. But I also think it is inappropriate for you to talk about "Hacking" up babies. Like Hack, I have NEVER participated in an abortion in any way, ever, but I support the right of women to make that painful decision for themselves. Does that make ME a "hacker of babies"? Heck, I still feel guilt over shooting a squirrel 40 years ago.

Now you are calling Hack a "Hypocrite". This is starting to sound a lot like a flame war that I got involved in last year, and I REALLY, REALLY HATE to see that happening. Can't we call a time out??

Like I said before, the issues involved are worthy of passion, but can't we keep it to the issues, and not personal attacks between two fine people like you and Hack? (I've never met you in person, but I have met Hack, and can vouch for him. I'm sure you are equally charming in person.)

So far, I've addressed this to Denise, but Sniffles, I really do think that you have been posting some pretty inappropriate personal stuff aimed at Denise, and you can make your points without resorting to personal digs. Your positions on the issues are valid enough to stand on their own merits. Just a suggestion.

The debating of ideas has suffered greatly as of late. I hate asking such a personal question, but from people who try to paint me as a murderer of babies, I don't know how else to shine the light on the ridiculousness of such arguments. I've told Denise that I'm done with such personal questions. I've tried making peace on here at least three times over the last two years. I've tried coffee parties; lunches; It always comes back to insults and personal attacks (two way street). I don't tend to ignore the "liberal weenie" "bed wetters" "demons of stupidity" stuff too well. Silence, in these waters, is seen as weakness to some. Jeff, you, Muddle, Cyclist, Yardman are incredible in your abilities to float above the scum. Me? I tend to put on my flippers, grab a snorkel, and free style around in the swamps from time to time. I'll chill.

Cheers, and thanks

Kevin "Hack" King

"I've told Denise that I'm done with such personal questions."

When?

"I've tried coffee parties; lunches."

That didn't make you treat BPR any nicer. And I remember Paul Perkins asking you to meet him for lunch and to come to a stem-cell discussion that one of the bloggers on here was having and you didn't come. But that's OK. Surely you support my CHOICE to maintain my privacy?

How do you define a personal attack? Your comments about Rush Limbaugh, maybe? BTW, I don't believe I've ever used "liberal weenie" or "bed wetters." "Demons of stupidity" accompanied the Dogbert avatar.

If you want to focus on the issues, that's great. But if you lob a "nasty" at me, don't expect me to ignore it. I believe in self-defense.

Your wounds were "collateral damage" in the war of words between Denise and Sniffles. (Both of whom make excellent points when they focus on the issues)

By the way, thanks for that video on the GAU-8. Watching that gun in action always gives me a "buzz"! (pun intended) While I was on YouTube watching that, I noticed some related videos, including a 22-cal version that was hand-cranked, just like the original Gatling Gun.

I think Muddle may soon need one of those, if his BB gun approach fails to deter the pesky squirrels. I'm reminded of "Caddyshack", and the epic struggle between Bill Murray's groundskeeper and the groovin' gopher. (Muddle--you need to keep us informed; this could get interesting!)

I've tried coffee parties; lunches; It always comes back to insults and personal attacks (two way street).

Was that a pretty good insult?

The Cattleman's is still awaiting us. My treat! Next possible rendezvous dates are 6/14 - 6/30. After that we'll go to the Farmers Market and discuss politics. Well... let's skip the ring if you don't mind.

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

And somehow we'll have to get Hutch and Cyclist out there as well, to unify the fleet!

Cheers,

Kevin "Hack" King

We'll check it out closer to the dates.

Cheers!

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

let's talk about the guys who don't worry about having their benefits and "salary" cut...let's talk about the guys who worry about how they are going to survive getting LAID OFF everytime the CEO gets a cold. Let's talk about the poor dumb schmuck who worked his entire life at the Ford plant making the best car he possible could so his company could prosper, only to have his good American company take his job overseas/out of the country. {WAIT..Let's blame Clinton and NAFTA for that one...that one is not Ford's fault...the damned Democrats took that job out of the country!!!)

BTW-Just curious- Do all Dems think money just magically appears awaiting to be distributed from those who earn it to those who don't?
No...Dems only hope that there could be some way for everyone working in this country to have access to health care, earn a decent wage, afford to feed a family and maybe, just maybe take care of an elderly parent, too. Dems only want a government that cares as much for its citizens as it does for its corporations. Do all Reps think "I got mine, now you get yours, while we put as many obstacles in front of you as we can"? Keep the faith.

Democracy is not a spectator sport.

you did my example?

I wasn't talking about Fortune 500 companies but rather the small businessowers (such as Git et al) who fuel the bulk of the new jobs that are created.

Seriously, I agree with you about the Ford CEO, but I have the answer. Rather than raise taxes rates across the board and kill small business owners like me maybe just maybe we use our power of choice. I'm pro-choice in all the following ways (sorry but I just can't get into a enthusiastic backing of killing innocent human life like your party does) but here are some choices that are fine.

Get all the Democrats (in the CEO example above) to quit buying Fords. Your party has lots of influence with the teacher's union(s). Get them to sell the stock of any company that acts in the irresponsible way you describe in your post.

You'll find that the stockholder's might just figure out the buyers are tired of the above methods and change things.

You might also be shocked just how much charity and help for the needy and down and out you find going on here in Fayette county with private funds and donations.

Why not pose the question to Git et al if they would do even more of this if Fed,State,real estate,sales,personal property, and excise taxes didn't take upwards of 50-60 cents of every dollar they work for.

You may not know this but the oil companies may currently be making about 9 cents on every gallon, but the government is "making" about 45-60 cents of excise tax on every gallon.

Who's the robber baron there?

Keep the dollar (with the one who earns it).

"I wasn't talking about Fortune 500 companies but rather the small businessowers (such as Git et al) who fuel the bulk of the new jobs that are created."

1) Where in the heck did you mention small businesses?

2) What in the world does that have to do with me and Git's talk on credibility?

3) Why would any American listen to any republican speak of job growth and the economy given our current jobs reports and the state of our economy under the current GWB and GOP fiscal policy?

4) In a results oriented environment, why should we re-elect YOUR guys, SDG? Why, why why??

ps, if you venture up a few posts, I left you a love note.

Kevin "Hack" King

Maybe whoever said you should read more carefully had a point!

Where in the heck did you mention small businesses?

Learn to read in context my friend you said,
a wealthy, conservative republicanish guy, tried to convince us all two weeks ago that there is no recession,

I'm replying to YOUR comment which referred to a small businessowner hence the context is the realm of small business and the economy.

Why are REPUBLICANS LIKE YOU always the last to see reality when it comes?
Also (I'm asking a big favor here) GET IT IN YOUR HEAD that I'm NOT a republican!!

Did you forget that I said Bush spent money like a drunken sailor??

Ah alas, I forgot the Hack 'em up rule.

Make one negative observation (in an older post) about Obama and be accused of being a (gasp) republican forever regardless of how many times you criticize the republicans! Oh yeah don't forget to accuse me of loving Rudy G. again!

In a results oriented environment, why should we re-elect YOUR guys

They are not my guys and you will be unable to find one post where I'm saying anything good about them.

My comment was regarding the negative effect of raising taxes on the small business owner and the resulting negative result on the economy.

If you would just read the post you'll see I agree with yardman about the abuses taking place at the CEO level of large companies.

What we disagree on is how to combat it.

I chose voting with our collective purchasing power whereas yardman seems to favor across the board tax hikes that will hurt the small business guy far more the the Fortune 500 CEO.

SDG, are YOU telling US there is NO recession comming or here now?

Sigh**-I used to wonder where you get this ability to say what someone never said until I understood the Hack 'em up rule above.

Of course, many segments are facing hard times.

Would these quote(s) help you understand?

"You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift."
"You cannot help small men by tearing down big men."
"You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong."

"You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer."
"You cannot help the poor man by destroying the rich."
"You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred."

"You cannot establish security on borrowed money."
"You cannot build character and courage by taking away men's initiative and independence."
"You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves."

WHO this guy is between me and Git's conversation, WHY is he here, and WHAT is his point?

If you are a "cut taxes and grow the economy" guy, THESE ARE YOUR GUYS. Period. Call yourself whatever you'd like.

"Somebody like Git is the perfect person to ask about the economy."

You actually said that, SDG? Let's recap.

Go up to Git's post "Great Blog HomeSweetHomePTC."

Git drags ME into this by calling me out as not being "credible." He puts himself in the unique position of judge of my credibility.

I, in my own defense, bring up points why I feel GIT is in NO POSITION to judge my credibility:

1) He is in recession denial

2) He feels we are in Iraq fighting for "secular Muslims????"

3)He criticizes Rev. Wright's "hate speech," but uses hate speech of his own calling all Muslims and the Qur'an "evil" I have explained to Git many times before that we fight alongside Muslims. I've trained Muslim fighter pilots. We are staging out of the Muslim country of Kuwait. But Git feels I'm not credible.

4) I question the viability of trickle down economics; didn't work for Reagan, GHWBush had to reverse course on it, and it hasn't worked for GWB.

You jump in and suggest I'm not credible because I don't run a small business? Who the? What the? Son of a?

Okay, SDG, you aren't a republican. You're just someone who jumped into this conversation between Git and I to talk small business and the need for more tax cuts?

Okay, SDG, my not republican friend, what is your point in this CREDIBILITY debate?

HAVE TAX CUTS WORKED? Is our federal budget deficit bigger or smaller than the last democrat left it?

Is there a case to be made based on DEMONSTRATED PERFORMANCE for re-electing republicans and continuing their economic policy?

Kevin "Hack" King

ps: What should I call your position?

conservative*
Republican-like
small businessican?

No more posting as "Hack up the facts" owns this blo..hey, wait a minute, it's The Citizen who owns this site.

You "Hacked the facts" again dude. Why not get really mad and falsely accuse me (again) of being a Rudy G. supporter?

You could learn a lesson from Yardman in civility. I made the comment that Yard seems to believe a certain thing and he corrected me.

I thanked him and found that we had some common ground (tariffs+CEO behavior) that we agreed on. We're building on that.

You, on the other hand, are quite different in behavior.

You asked about tax cuts working. Is the US Treasury a good enough source for you ??

You really need to take a course in logic from Denise. You rant about companies going under but did you ever check to see if one or two of the small airlines you mentioned went under because of poor management?

You rant about the mortgage crisis,but when people falsify their application and over state their income by 300-500% it is somehow the governments fault ??

You took the shot at Git's economic judgment and I commented that due to his position of hiring,firing,daily hitting the sales markets,dealing with his bankers,etc. etc. that he just might have a better feel about the economy than you get at 12,000 feet in the air.

Your response- What are you doing in MY conversation??

Facts are stubborn things are they not my friend??

Ok fine-go ahead and tell me how Bush caused global warming, etc.

I'll wait till your trademark "Hack up the facts" surfaces again and try not to interrupt your anti-Git rants.

Have a nice day,

If you are going to have a fighter pilot avatar, please don't trash our image by crying like a girl. Dude! At this point we're having a circular argument which is almost silly (on both of our parts).

I couldn't tell you came looking for polite fiscal debate:

"Unless you can tell me you honestly have ever worried about your military or Delta health benefits being reduced because of the company's economic struggles OR how you spend some off time figuring how to work harder and make your company more profit so they could pay you more or not shave benefits-- you are (and I quote) NOT CREDIBLE."

umm... we were talking economic recession, right? Macro economics, yes?

Here is your recollection of our ummm, talk:

"You took the shot at Git's economic judgment and I commented that due to his position of hiring,firing,daily hitting the sales markets,dealing with his bankers,etc. etc. that he just might have a better feel about the economy than you get at 12,000 feet in the air.

Your response- What are you doing in MY conversation??"

SDG, my memory is not so good. So I went up three clicks of the mouse and found my response which YOU DIDN'T ANSWER: I ask again,

Is there a case to be made based on DEMONSTRATED PERFORMANCE for re-electing republicans and continuing their economic policy?

You say you aren't a republican, but we have two economic choices, right? Obama and the dems or John McCain. Care to answer the question above?

"BTW-Just curious- Do all Dems think money just magically appears awaiting to be distributed from those who earn it to those who don't?"

No SDG, we don't. THAT'S why we dems have been saying we need to ACTUALLY PAY FOR THE WAR WE ARE FIGHTING NOW AND PAYING FOR WITH FUTURE GENERATIONS" MONEY.

How 'bout we call this a draw, or you can declare victory, and we stick a fork in it?

Cheers,

"Kevin "Hack" King

to reset the meter to zero,call it even and try to start again with you.

BTW- Was the above post enough or do you want more?
You asked about tax cuts working. Is the US Treasury a good enough source for you ??

But then you had to go and use your trademark "Hack up the truth" with Denise.

As mentioned above, get a course in how to blog with manners from Yardman and how to debate in logic from Denise.

You used to be the voice of mediation for the left wing on this blog. Now you speak to women in terms of b**e me and vile insults.

only to be confronted by real human beings with real names who are also "children of God" and "created in His image?"

Does that include the "Hacked up" bodies of children you so willingly support abortion for?

SDG, you repeated this:

"BTW- Was the above post enough or do you want more?
You asked about tax cuts working. Is the US Treasury a good enough source for you ??"

SDG, I asked this:

"HAVE TAX CUTS WORKED? Is our federal budget deficit bigger or smaller than the last democrat left it?

Is there a case to be made based on DEMONSTRATED PERFORMANCE for re-electing republicans and continuing their economic policy?"

Your chart on "How to win the argument?"

It gave us tax receipts for the first two months of '02 through '06.

It showed receipts increasing from $245 million in '02 to $289 million in '06.

SDG, here is what it did not show:

1) What would the increase in tax receipts have been if taxes had not been cut?

2) What was the change in federal budget deficit during that time?

Because we are talking about a budget that is not independent of liabilities, we have to ask if conservative economic policy is "paying the bills." If we currently spend more than we make, and we get a $1000 a month raise; then we spend $2000 more a month, we would have a failure of budgeting, in my opinion.

This is a more useful number, in my opinion; the actual federal budget deficit. And it is STILL INCREASING

The growing federal budget deficit

Kevin "Hack" King

I found this chart which should help you understand.

Now onto your comments:

1) What would the increase in tax receipts have been if taxes had not been cut?

Historically, (from JFK on) receipts would have been a lot less as tax from capital gains go down as rates go up.

2) What was the change in federal budget deficit during that time?
It went up (as I've posted before) because BOTH parties spend like a drunken sailor OR "Like John Edwards at a hair salon."

Because we are talking about a budget that is not independent of liabilities, we have to ask if conservative economic policy is "paying the bills." If we currently spend more than we make, and we get a $1000 a month raise; then we spend $2000 more a month, we would have a failure of budgeting, in my opinion.

Considering the majority of your post are about the war (and I'm not a big proponent of the way we're fighting it now) SURELY you realize you would factor out war spending to get an apples to apples comparison of the growth in debt??

Now back to the chart. Don't be confused by the different X-Y axis.
It simply shows that there is a point that you can kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.

It's small business(s) (as a group) and companies like Git's that are fueling job growth. The Fortune 500 are trading employess and downsizing.

If, as you seem to want, you increase the tax burden beyond a certain point to pay for social health care et. al., then revenues go down.

Let me make it simple for you. I thought, some time ago, about adding five people into a new division of my company. I didn't do it primarily because the rate of return was too small.

Now (here's the part the requires some thinking) IF you increase my costs (via the tax rates) another 10-20%, I'll not only not add those jobs, I'll shave back another 5-10% of the ones that exist.

Us small guys won't have the Fed to bail us out like some other high-flying corps.

We have to find a way to turn a profit.

Understand?

I like the way you reset the center button and then urinated on it.

"Does that include the "Hacked up" bodies of children you so willingly support abortion for?"

Okay, since you feel Denise is the voice of reason, and I just woke up one day and decided to start insulting people for no reason:

Ask your Denise if she has ever had an abortion.

Then get back to me on my pro choice position.

Kevin "Hack" King

"I just woke up one day and decided to start insulting people for no reason."

Well, actually you did. You began insulting me (but not to my "face") in your posts to Jeffc (or was it "C" that J.C. $niffles was using then?) because I said "President Peanut" and commented on Beaver's post about Jimmy.

After I declined "Jeff"'s insistence that I read Palestine: Peace not Apartheid and pro-Jimmy links when the thread was about Valerie Plame, you twisted my words and accused me of not having "all of the facts" (as if you do ) or having "read up on these issues."

(“The truth – when twisted by good [proficient] liars, can always make an innocent person look bad – especially if the innocent person is honest and admits his mistakes.”)

Then followed your single-minded mantras: "cut and paste winch [sic] doing the demon's work for the RNC," "RNC p!ss girl, doing the dirty work," "lunatic," "wack job," "devoid of a conscience," "not interested in truth," "winch" [sic].

"Jeff Carter, we are wasting valuable time and intellect."

Yes, you & "Saint Jeff" are among the few who are "seeking actual truth, understanding, and or enlightenment." Have you arrived?

"Greetings Jeff. You must be a great parent!"

You continued your diatribe: "loons," "biggots [sic] and the ignorant," "a completely enslaved, mindless errand runner, winch comes to mind," "those who do not wish the light of truth to shine upon them."

You sound so much like $nifflin' Basmati, especially the way you both fawn over "Jeff," that it's almost scary.

"Ask your Denise if she has ever had an abortion."

Why don't you ask me yourself? Do you usually ask women such personal questions about their private lives?

I could ask similar questions (How many times have you cheated on your wife? How many STDs do you have? When was your last DRE? Has your ER improved? Have you ever been arrested?), but that wouldn't be any of my business, now would it?

It’s uncanny how much you sound like Mainly $niffin' Bas: "Exactly how many abortions have you had, anyway?"

(This is $nif’s D.A. impersonation, or is it Henry Fonda?)

So, are you saying that anyone who has sinned (such as becoming an alcoholic or drug addict or even killing someone in a fit of anger or DUI) cannot be forgiven and cannot want someone else not to make a similar wrong choice and experience the consequences of that choice (physical and emotional effects of addiction, stealing to support your habit, hurting your family, maiming or killing someone)?

Abortion stops a beating heart!

Do you realize when you link back to show how nasty I am for no reason, you always deliver us forensic evidence as to how you are as ugly as old Hack to the most reasonable people on line? You rejoiced in demeaning a father to his son, because you know his son is a gentle diplomat. Your words as delivered by you:

"Jeff Carter - Son of President of Peanut
Denise Conner's picture
Submitted by Denise Conner on Sun, 04/01/2007 - 11:51pm.

Out! Out! You demons of stupidity!

I believe that he's the know-it-all son of the infamous President Peanut, born Donnel Jeffrey Carter in 1952."

I really think you are a can short of that six pack.

Mute engaged

Kevin "Hack" King

JeffC, or is it Jeffc (a.k.a. J.C. Sniffles), "a gentle diplomat"? Fawning again. He's "employed" at The Carter Center for World Fascism Studies, and he's almost as "nasty" and condescending as you when he refers to my "profound ignorance." But he didn't call me a "winch."

For someone who's "speechless" and promises to ignore my comments, you surely do have diarrhea of the mouth. Is your MUTE button broken? A muzzle might work.

President Peanut Jimmy Carter: A Terrorist's Best Friend

Dogbert: Out! Out! You demons of stupidity!

I tuned in briefly and really enjoyed this "rasslin match" as $age would say. That was some really rich stuff and thanks a million SDG for gitting it. I'll jump back in the fray real soon. As for the moment I just came out of a 12 hour continuous thunderstorm that left us with 4" of rain and flooded roads. Guess it'll be an inside the barn work day for today and tomorrow. Hack....please promise me Delta will get me home on time Sat morn.

Cheers Men!

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

to the airport, Know that I've been thinking about you guys. I was out there on the 8th and 9th. The drive down HWY 74 to OKC was enough to convince me I need new tires. It was raining faster than my modest tread grooves could shed it. That is absolutely the most white-knuckle driving I've done on anything other than snow! Delta got me to MIA and back with the two oldest King kids. We did a college visit to U of Miami, but American tried to throw a wrench in the works. The airports have been pretty chaotic places lately, but the early flight back to ATL paid off. I had to wake the kids with a fire hose though .

When you get back, let's you and I see if we can bring the humor back into this relationship. With some here, there is no point in me trying to communicate, but you and I have something special. I AIN'T QUITTIN YOU!

Kevin "Hack" King

What's this "cheers men!", that wouldn't be discriminatory now would it? Just checking . . .when you really gonna be back so I can get the office back in order!

Be careful with all that crazy weather.

What's this "cheers men!", that wouldn't be discriminatory now would it? Just checking . . .when you really gonna be back so I can get the office back in order!

Be careful with all that crazy weather.

The feud between Sniffles and Denise, for example.

River, why don't you push $nif's reset button, if he has one, before he's banned again? Surely you remember a couple of episodes where you weren't treated civilly and needed to respond to "misrepresentations" intended to besmirch your character? I tried to "reset" a friend to help you out, but it didn't work too well.

"When he would come to visit, everyone would run and hide. They acted like they were scared to death of him. He had a really bad temper."

Denise, I can't press the Reset button for you or Sniffles, or anybody else but myself. But I can tell you how to do it. It's all about avoiding attacks on the other bloggers' character and keeping your sense of humor. We can disagree without attacking each other's character to make our points.

As you mentioned, you tried to back me up when I called somebody out for "Character Assassination". I really did appreciate that, by the way. I also appreciate the fact that Cal finally stepped in and put a stop to that.

I don't agree with every point you make, but I do agree with you on the need for people to take responsibility for their own actions. I also believe that success is a lot harder for some people than others, based on their circumstances. You don't seem to give a lot of credence to that concept. Try watching the movie "Pursuit of Happyness" with Will Smith. (I have to warn you that it is a little depressing at times.)

Most of all, I hope that everybody keeps their sense of humor. I told Git that his greatest weapon was his sense of humor. That applies to you and Hack as well. Lately, everybody seems to be getting a little snarly. SO LIGHTEN UP, EVERYBODY!!!

I saw previews of that movie but haven't gotten the DVD. Rather unusual to see a father-son movie and one that is so inspirational.

Have you read Chris Gardner's autobiography?

I Am Legend has logical gaps, but Smith plays an admirable character. Akeelah and the Bee is a good story.

"Success is a lot harder for some people than others, based on their circumstances." Harder but not impossible to some degree, and I do believe in helping others (Pregnancy Resource Centers, Salvation Army, etc.), but I've seen more long-term success with the "tough love" approach.

Just teasing about the reset button!

my "yardman radar" was up and I had to respond here.

I chose voting with our collective purchasing power whereas yardman seems to favor across the board tax hikes that will hurt the small business guy far more the the Fortune 500 CEO.

Unless I am wrong, I do not believe that I mentioned raising taxes as a solution to anything. Personally, I am not all that enthralled with raising taxes. I am more of a "rearrange our priorities"- type of guy. WAY too much money going to firms like Halliburton and Blackwater, not to mention that financial quagmire we are involved in concerning Iraq in general. I appreciate your support of my statements concerning CEOs of American companies concerned only about the bottom line rather than the American workers. You want solutions, raise tariffs on goods we produce here at home and keep the money in the pockets of our workers(someone else suggested this in the last few days and I tend to agree with the idea}.

I am, afterall, a citizen of Fayette County...don't try to hang that "tax and spend" rap on me. LOL...Keep the faith

Democracy is not a spectator sport.

You want solutions, raise tariffs on goods we produce here at home and keep the money in the pockets of our workers . . .

Interestingly enough, tariffs were the major way the founding fathers intended the Fed to create revenues.

Thanks for the clarification on your position. It wasn't my intent to misstate your goals.

Anyone who can read and comprehend a newspaper has known for years that Clayton Co. wasn’t capable of properly running their own business. We’ve known Clayton’s schools have been on probation for 2 years and the school board has done nothing. It didn’t take a rocket scientist to immediately figure out that bill 458 was Clayton’s way of making other Counties pay for their stupidity and incompetence. It didn’t boil down to the words “shall or may”, or a governments lawyer’s interpretation. It was common sense and Ronnie Chance knew what he was doing. It was the old “you scratch my back now and I’ll scratch yours later deal;” and to hell with the people. The people don’t know what’s going on anyway. That’s the attitude of all governments, including Ronnie’s hometown Tyrone government. What we need is a new system and attitude about government incorporating the old saying, “he who governs least, governs best”. We have enough laws. What we don’t have is Federal, State and local representatives who will enforce all of their current laws. This revolt against R. Chance is a harbinger of things to come - a total revolution against our governments. And, an economic recession is a good time to start it. R. Chance should have read Thomas Paine’s 1776 essays entitled “Common Sense” and the “Rights of Man.” Paine’s words are as true today and they were at the birth of this nation. “These are the times that try men’s souls”.

Git - I hope your stay on the dude ranch helps to chill you out. I just love the venom spewing from your flapping lips. You lose credibility on this blog because of your personal rage - chill, pal. Typical nasty Republican:

"Are you really that stupid?"

"Look you clueless twit."

"you re-hashed recycled former Democrats"

"Hack, Sniffles, Main Stream and Yardguy..." do you really HATE us that much?

"Does that mean that if I'm ever pulled over for being intoxicated (Mein Stream Minded)," Are you implying something here? I'm not sure where this came from and why?! Shall I speak with a lawyer regarding slanderous posts? Are you saying I drive while being intoxicated? Care to edit your post, sir? I will be copying this to a Word document before you edit this comment and will be discussing this with someone.

Nasty, mean, senseless... you're falling into the same category as denise and beeper. Your posts used to have some substance to them but they have become increasingly meaningless because of the nasty attacks sprinkled throughout.

Time to ignore your posts, as well as dense's and beepers...

Oh, it's just Mein Scream. Why is it that you have difficulty sorthing the humorous sarcasm from the arguement? You remind me of a war protester spitting on Vietnam Vet returning home. Unable to seperate the man in the uniform from the conflict. You just don't get it do you? Have a wonderful day.

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

sucks.

I might be crushed. But, coming from Sniffle's dream woman. I take it as a compliment. Now go attempt an original thought.

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

NOW FOR AN IMPORTANT SIDE NOTE: Hack, Sniffles, Main Stream and Yardguy...... If you EVER want any recognition of credibility from many of "my kind" then might I suggest you start holding your pack of weasels to the same critical bi-partisan standards as many us do who sit not in your camp. Remember that being a Democrat in no way exempts or excuses the bad behavior and lack of integrity that permeates the donkey party.

I am a bit confused about this particular paragraph. I understand what you are saying, but I am a confused as to WHY you said it. We struggle to re-form our party of choice to be responsive to the needs of the people. I know...you will pick apart what we advocate and claim that "we don't advocate that", but the fact remains that we sat down and addressed the concerns of our membership. I will state again here as I have stated before...I see NO similar thing coming from the other side of the aisle. Where are the concerns for the voters and the people of the county? Or is that what Ronnie and Matt displayed this week?

There are plenty of issues on importance to the people of PTC, F'ville, Tyrone, Brooks and Fayette County that are not reflected in the campaign of Hillary/Barack. If people have complaints about the national tickets that are being proposed, that is fine, but don't hang those complaints on the local party people. Yes, we are bound to support our national candidates to one degree or another. But we are ALSO bound to listen to our members locally and struggle to represent them to the best of our ability. And since all politics are local, we would be terrible remiss if we did not address those local issues. Keep the faith.

Democracy is not a spectator sport.

"There are plenty of issues of importance to the people of PTC, F'ville, Tyrone, Brooks and Fayette County that are not reflected in the campaign of Hillary/Barack... don't hang those complaints on the local party people."

Well said, yardman. I thought the same thing after I read Git's nasty anti-Dem post. But it seems to be his typical mantra of hating Dem's, whether it is on a local or national level. Truly sad.

I actually saw the rush of ALL of the Fayette Citizens to quickly change that impending bill, as truly inspiring! I never saw it as a Democrat vs. Republican thing! It was the citizenry coming together, to make a change, for the better. It was great to see Dem and Rep standing together, having our voices heard, changing the system!

Git is way off here.

Why did I not expect such a response? You appear to be fog. Gosh I hate to use this wore out Muddle term, but "whatever". Why would I expect you to get it.
________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

so much for constructive dialogue. And thus the two sides will go wandering off into oblivion, each set in the realization that they are right and the other side is wrong. Keep the faith.

Democracy is not a spectator sport.

I'll continue holding the dirt bags that are closest to my politcal views accountable while you continue your denials and the defense of yours. There's nothing to talk about here. Either show me the money or continue with your atypical politcal views. Good day.

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

You're exactly right, the "process" only worked because the citizens had to EXPLAIN what the bill meant to airheaded legislators who weren't paying attention. It's one thing to have a difference of opinion on policy, it's entirely different when your rep has to have pending legislation read to him and told "hey bonehead, do you realize what this says? You don't? WHAT????"

One of things that makes Fayette great is active and pretty informed citizens, but we shouldn't have to watch our legislators like a hawk because they aren't capable of reading comprehension of bills that THEY created. This wasn't an exercise in a process working; it was an exercise in stupidity that got caught just in time to head off a nightmare.

I'd love to chat with you on this but I have a cattle trailer to catch. Later!

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

might I suggest you start holding your pack of weasels to the same critical bi-partisan standards as many us do who sit not in your camp.

Here's one way of holding weasels accountable.

Weasel Stomping Day

I love you man!

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

Read the above post.
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Caution - The Surgeon General has determined that constant blogging is an addiction that can cause a sedentary life style.

Now let's flush 'em.

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS WORKED

Yes it did; but, only after our alert local schools officials got the word out. I really hope something was learned by this whole episode.

BTW, please try hard to stay away from special interest and lobby money. It just doesn't look good to us common folk.

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Caution - The Surgeon General has determined that constant blogging is an addiction that can cause a sedentary life style.

It wasn't because of Ronny that nothing bad happened, if there hadn't been such an uproar that bill would have passed as it was and Fayette would have been hosed, so like you said let's all put on our big boy pants and get a grip, instead of admitting he messed up you get on here and try to explain it all away. No there wasn't a moral lapse but there was a lapse in judgment and if he going to take the job he's going to have to take the whole job, and that includes being chastised when he goes whoops. Too bad the job isn't all sweetness and light, but if he didn't know that before, I bet he knows now.

I yam what I yam....Popeye

Amen Hutch. I wish I would have had Cy's cell number this morning at about 1:00. Could have really used his Delta connections and influence to git me out of a bind at ATL. Worst flying day (or lack there-of I've ever had. Another story...... Weather. But Thank God For All Of This Marvelous Rain. At least we can all agree on that part.... except the God part.

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

unless you're having your roof replaced.

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Caution - The Surgeon General has determined that constant blogging is an addiction that can cause a sedentary life style.

I thought this was his mommy.

I yam what I yam....Popeye

I thought it was Eric Dial.

And everytime we see Eric we sneak up behind him and give him a 'Tugger'.... I mean a wedgy?

________

The Sissy And The Word Defined

With his letter to the editor, in which he paternalistically asks us to "take a step back and see how we could have handled ourselves better," Eric certainly earned a "tugger" in my book! While trying to convince us that he is "one of the biggest advocates you will ever meet" when it comes to the right of free speech, he actually lets us know in no uncertain terms that he doesn't want people criticizing his buddy Senator Chance, especially since we were all "misinformed" of the situation anyway. Instead, he insults the voters without whom SB 458 might have just slid on through, with Chance's help! Eric's exaggeration of equating the citizens' disgruntlement with Chance with a desire for a "hanging in the town square" was ridiculous. Chance screwed up big time by not paying attention (or having someone pay attention for him) to legislation that could have cost Fayette County dearly, and the people let him know it! Eric's warning to the little people ("I urge you to proceed with caution") would be better directed at Chance before he votes. So yes, Eric wins a tugger from the Tugger this week!