Christi,
I don't think there are that many Coweta County citizens doing so at the moment. BUT, the future City of Mcintosh and future City of East Coweta will send many thousands through PTC - - just look at the published master land use plans...it is inevitable that the major ATL bound route for much of the City Mcintosh will be to 74 via TDK. As that becomes too choked, drivers wille begin alternate routes through PTC. After getting out of PTC, eventually many will head east and then head north up Flat Creek (already know those that do so now).

The majority of GA license plates have the county of residence written on the bottom. When sitting in rush hour traffic between GA 85 and I 85, close to 1/2 the plates read "COWETA" (if they have the county indicated). This was a little game my carpool played last week. Now this is not scientific, we only saw the plates of those speeding past us!!!

I'm assuming that Senoia residents are the ones cluttering up your roadways? Am I right? They would be the closest to Ga 85 of course. Gosh, I need a break, my brain just can't take all this hypothisizing.

Last week's carpool driver lives near Brooks. We meet at parking lot on Crosstown. Brooks driver did his best to count as he drove. 74 is only two lanes south of 54 and four lanes north but all along many intersections have right and left turn lanes. We decided since GA tags are only on rear bumpers, any rear bumper that went "past" the back seat rider would count if the tag were visable. If a car moved into a turn lane, it went past and counted.

We don't know where each driver lives. They could be PTC residents who drive company cars registered in Coweta. So christi could be right - we don't know for sure where the car or driver comes from. I said it wasn't scientific. During the week, the three cars that passed on the right- on the shoulder were two Coweta and one Meriweather. FYI during evening rush hour on I-85S at the Senoia Rd exit, every car that cut over to the exit at the last second, crossing the solid white line had Fayette tags.

Remember we were not sitting in one spot looking at every tag. In a manner of explanation, we would travel in somewhat of the same pack each day, each way, seeing only those cars that traveled with us, sped past, or slowed for a turn.

The point was christi didn't seem to think that Coweta residents were using roadways in Fayette County to get to Atlanta, nor would they use 74 in the future. I think those that use 74 know differently. Fayette County doesn't own Hwy 74. Anyone can drive it. Oh yeah! one of our riders does live near Senoia, but their car tags only make the whole trip one week per month.

One one hand, the driver is sitting in rush-hour traffic on GA 85(Hwy 74). On the other, everyone speeding past the driver is from Coweta. This seems to imply that Coweta drivers are actually trying to get somewhere while the Fayette driver is not and is "sitting in a rush-hour traffic."

NUK

Of course you don't understand! We are talking about the new cities going in down south 74 from PTC and across the creek into Coweta, near the PTC airport. Not where Coweta citizens live now. And beside if you happen to live in that area, you don't have any other choice now but to go to Newnan, do you? Geez. Think it through.

Obviously, I did not realize that you were talking about new "cities". I'm not an idiot.

Hate to act like the 50+ spinster I am, but the following --cut and pasted from the blogs tonite seem offensive to me. Maybe I'm just envious of two young people connecting, but please be consistent in your enforcement.

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new
You don't have to be a prick.
Submitted by christi on Tue, 09/26/2006 - 10:58am.
Obviously, I did not realize that you were talking about new "cities". I'm not an idiot.

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Chrisi: Idiot (not)
Submitted by Hardtack on Tue, 09/26/2006 - 12:33pm.
"obviously, I did NOT realize you were talking about new "cities." YOU said the preceding, which makes it even harder for me to understand where you are coming from. Let me put it this way: if a road was built from 74 in PTC to your home, would you take it to Atlanta--through PTC, or would you still go the other way? What do you hate about pricks, anyway.

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Pri...I mean Hardtack
Submitted by christi on Tue, 09/26/2006 - 2:24pm.
Just teasing. To answer your question, I would take Hwy. 154 straight to the interstate.

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I posted hastily because his response kind of upset me. Although I don't consider pr*** to be a curse word, it is not the best choice of words that I could have used. I apologize. I'm kind of surprised about this because I NEVER cuss!

"obviously, I did NOT realize you were talking about new "cities." YOU said the preceding, which makes it even harder for me to understand where you are coming from. Let me put it this way: if a road was built from 74 in PTC to your home, would you take it to Atlanta--through PTC, or would you still go the other way? What do you hate about pricks, anyway.

Just teasing. To answer your question, I would take Hwy. 154 straight to the interstate.

Then you don't live where the big "city" is to be built and which will interfere with PTC traffic! You are a little fuzzy and hard to decipher.

If I was right at the very edge of PTC/Coweta, I'd hang a left on 54/34 and go to 154 to get on to I-85. 74 sux during rush hour and it's not going to get better. Ahhh, for those heady days of going about 80mph at 7am and no stoplights on Hwy 74. It was too good to last.

I can also remember going to Fayetteville on 54 and doing 55. Oh wait, THAT is the actual speed limit, though it is seemingly unknown to the mass of pathetic sheep who go 40 and want to be in the left lane because they are turning left on GA 85 in 10 miles. You could make the road 8 lanes and the idiots would still go 40 and be in every lane but the right.

NUK

North on 74 to Tyorne, Palmetto/Collingsworth Road to I-85 is about eight or so miles farther than just straight up 74 but during rush hour it’s about 10 to 15 minuets faster.

Works for both morning and evening rush hours.

P.S. The Tyrone City Council said that they have already noticed a “significant increase in traffic”. No doubt due to the ongoing abortion that South Fulton has created at the 74 / I-85 interchange.

To keep traffic under control Tyrone as suggested that they may allow cows back on the road.

More coverup or ignorance (and I doubt you are ignorant) about the location of the new city at the extension of TDK. Pretty long drive on GA 34 and country roads to intersection of 54/34. They will go across TDK extension, for sure!

I think there will be the big development there regardless of TDK. And all up and down 54 before it becomes 34. You see who owns the land and it's more than just for speculative investing.....I have no doubt that it isn't a bluff that East Coweta Big is going to happen. Now, whether PTC should play a part in "helping" that happen by green-lighting TDK is another issue.

NUK

A couple of things to keep in mind, projected number of people includes minor children and students so assuming a family of four, two of them (students) aren't heading to Atlanta to work.

These people were never figured into the calculations.

First off the GA DoT derived the number of 55,656 trips/day. Of that number some 40% is anticipated using Hyw. 74. There are currently over 25,500 trips/day on 74. So do the math, 40% of 55,656 = 22,263.4 trips/day. Now add the 25,500 current use and 22,263.4 and you get 47,462.4 trips/day on 74.

That only takes into account the TDK traffic.

Now add into that an additional number for the Sharpsberg and West Village and you will easily exceed 60,000 trips/day on 74.

Second, if you look at job growth projections

Lets do that. The average price of a home in the new McIntosh subdivision is slated to be between be $250,000 and $400,000. Just how many Kia employees are going to have to live in one house in order to be able to afford the mortgage? Currently a single police officer, fireman and school teacher can’t afford to live in PTC. The standard rule of thumb for determining whether or not one can afford a home is to use three times the annual salary.

A police officer in PTC makes about $35,000, 3 x 35,000 = $105,000. They can’t afford to live there.

A teacher in PTC makes about $38,000, 3 x 38,000 = $114,000. They can’t afford to live there.

A fireman in PTC makes about 32,000, 3 x 32,000 = $96,000. They can’t afford to live there.

Most retail jobs pay around $10 to $15 dollars/hr. so figure 3 x 27,000 = $81,000. They can’t afford to live there.

Just how many jobs are there in Fayette County or Coweta County that pay around $83,000 a year? Damn few!

So it looks like most of these home owners will be commuting to Atlanta each and every day.

Third, you all act like we will wake up one morning and BAM!, thousands of cars on TDK/Hwy. 74. Remember, the buildout and completion of McIntosh is projected to be 2016. I assure you by that time, TDK and Hwy 74 will both be four lanes and can handle the increase in traffic.

Unless you have a couple hundred million you plan on donating for this, please don’t bother assuring me of anything.

It took over 5 years for 54 to be widened to four lanes and that was for a piece of road about 4 miles long and both counties worked with the state to get it done.

If you haven’t noticed, 74 from 54 to the I-85 interchange is about 12 miles. Oh by the way, Fulton County controls about three miles of the north end. The bridge 74 that goes over I-85 is scheduled to be widened in 2020.

The state of Georgia is about $10 DILLION short for the road improvements that are on the books now. So please tell me WHERE”S THE MONEY GOING TO COME FROM?

If they started planning today to widen 74 it wouldn’t be finished for 10 to 15 years from now.

When industry looks to relocate, one of the first things it looks for is workforce.

This is my personal favorite. Industrial jobs, ie manufacturing jobs don’t pay didly.
Photocircuits left because it cost to much to keep doing business in PTC. If you were to bother you would see that a great many of the cars the employees drive have tags from Meriwether County. You can still buy a reasonably nice home there for $90,000. Those people come here to slave away at low paying jobs and take their hard earned pay back home with them. They don’t spend it here in PTC in fancy shops or high priced restaurants.

There goes your tax idea.

Go back and look at the original post....Save Our City said to figre out a "way to get those 50,000 new residents to I-85 without going through PTC!!" Not 50,000 trips but 50,000 new residents!! That's my point....you all keep coming up with new numbers to justify a position. But hey, why let the facts get in the way of a good post, right? Just keep pumping out higher and higher numbers until we forget the true estimates.

As for your trip calculations, where are you coming from with the four day per car figure? If the calculations are for people going to work, you go to work, you go home....that's two trips not four. So lets cut your figures in half and that might be more realistic.

As for your comments on the price of housing, go look at the plans submitted for Lake McIntosh. Yes it contains houses in the price range you mention. But how convenient of you to fail to mention it also includes mixed housing including townhomes substantially less expensive than what you mention as well as apartments, all of which your examples could easily afford. Besides, in your faulty math equations, you are assuming only one paycheck per household and you know in today's world, that just ain't the way it is, hoss.

By the way, the Kia jobs will average just under $60,000.00 per job (some higher, some lower) so I don't think alot of those folks would have any trouble affording housing in Lake McIntosh if they so choose. (Your theory about 3 times the salary went out as a rule of thumb during the Reagan years.)

As for the Highway 74 comments, how convenient of you to leave out the fact that the GA DOT has already committed funding to fast track the widening of Highway 74 way past the TDK Blvd intersection (I believe the completion date given was 2010 but certainly way before the buildout date of 2016 for Lake McIntosh). But hey, why let the facts get in the way of a good post (again!). And besides, what the heck does the bridge at I-85 have to do with traffic on Highway 74 in PTC??

Finally, your comments on the tax digest show a really bad lack of tax implications that go far beyond "shopping in fancy shops or eating in restaurants". You always want your county to have a good ratio of business/industry to residential taxation and unfortunately PTC/Fayette County relies way too heavily on homeowners (i.e., a bedroom community). That's all well and good until the real estate market starts to go south then you have trouble. The truth is we need to recruit good paying industry here to help offset this problem

One other thing, your comment about "manufacturing jobs don't pay diddly" is so far off base I can't believe you said that. There are so many examples here in GA where we've lost good manufacturing jobs only to have them replaced by low paying service industry jobs. Of course you won't hear that in the politicians election ads. Good example...Brown & Williamson in Macon....lost jobs averaging $26.00 per hour and job replacement wages are averaging around $13.00 per hour.

Correction:

Georgia is 74 BILLION short on funds.
From the 2005-2035 GEORGIA STATEWIDE
TRANSPORTATION PLAN
Total revenues are forecast to be $86 billion for the 30-year Plan period, compared to total costs of the Build/ Financially Unconstrained scenario of $160 billion, leaving a funding gap of $74 billion. This deficit threatens the future economic vitality of the State and the quality of life of its residents. The inability to meet the State’s ever growing transportation needs, and the congestion which will result from this failure, will in all likelihood choke off or greatly reduce forecasted levels of economic growth and degrade the quality of life of its residents.

Your claim of revitalizing the industrial area is also way off. According to the Georgia Baseline Employment Forecast by Industry 2000-2035, page 123, chart 5-11, Manufacturing in the state of Georgia is forecast to decline 20%, while services, construction, transportation and construction are forecasted to increase.

Traffic counter Information from the Georgia DoT STARS System

TC Number: 0300
RCLink: 1131007400
Beginning Milepoint: 4.95
Ending Milepoint: 7.25
Midpoint: 6.1
2005 Truck Percent: 7.90%
2005 AADT: 28080
2005 Count Type: Actual
2005 Direction: NonDir
2004 AADT: 24513
2004 Count Type: Estimate
2004 Direction: NonDir
2003 AADT: 12033 / 12045
2003 Count Type: Actual / Actual
2003 Direction: North / South
2002 AADT: 11753 / 11525
2002 Count Type: Actual / Actual
2002 Direction: North / South
2001 AADT: 23800
2001 Count Type: Estimate
2001 Direction: NonDir
2000 AADT: 11718 / 11317
2000 Count Type: Actual / Actual
2000 Direction: North / South
1999 AADT: 26757
1999 Count Type: Estimate
1999 Direction: NonDir

Please read the 2005 AADT number of 28,080 trips/day.

As far as your claim that As for your trip calculations, where are you coming from with the four day per car figure? you read it wrong.

The number of “trips/day” came from the GA DoT study that was done as a result of the proposed TDK extension. The total number of trips is estimated at 55,656 trips/day. Of that number some 40%, not four times, is slated to use Hwy. 74 to commute to Atlanta. The 40% was again provided by the GA DoT.

As for your comments on the price of housing, go look at the plans submitted for Lake McIntosh. Yes it contains houses in the price range you mention. But how convenient of you to fail to mention it also includes mixed housing including townhomes substantially less expensive than what you mention as well as apartments, all of which your examples could easily afford. Besides, in your faulty math equations, you are assuming only one paycheck per household and you know in today's world, that just ain't the way it is, hoss.

As per your claim of “alternative housing” your are incorrect again.
From the original article in the Citizen

The residential component of the development will be clustered on 926 acres and offer a variety of homestyles. Homes will start at $250,000 and top out at the top level of $2 million. Single family homes will have a minimum of 2,000 square feet. There will also be 100 retirement homes, 150 townhomes and 164 lofts above the commercial component. The architecture of the homes will be historic in nature, and resemble homes found in Savannah, New Orleans and Charleston.

Out of a total of 3,164 homes 7.9% will be retirement homes or Townhouses. The last time I looked, “Retirement Homes”, such as those in Kedren and on Willow Creek Drive, were selling at over $200,000. What are you thinking about. Nowhere are apartments mentioned, so don’t even go there.

As for the Highway 74 comments, how convenient of you to leave out the fact that the GA DOT has already committed funding to fast track the widening of Highway 74 way past the TDK Blvd intersection

The “Fasttrack” you are referring to is to widen 74 from Hwy. 85 to Hwy. 54. If you looked at a map you see that is the middle of PTC to the south, NOT north to I-85.

There are currently NO plans to widen Hwy. 74 for 54 to the I-85 interchange.

Finally, There are so many examples here in GA where we've lost good manufacturing jobs only to have them replaced by low paying service industry jobs., you just made my point for me.
Industrial/manufacturing jobs are being “outsourced” due to labor costs. They're going away, not coming in.

The new 1.2 billion dollar Kia automotive plant is going to be in Troup County and is anticipated to employ a “total” 2,000 employees. Less than half will be making the $60,000/year that you are inferring. The majority of those folks will be coming from the two recently closed plants. So that should help the already out of work UAW employees, not create new jobs for non-UAW employees.

Bottom line, TDK and what it brings to the table will NOT help the current transpiration or tax problems that Fayette County has coming its way.

Where do you come up with these facts and figures? The Kia plant is anticipated to employ a "total" of 2,000 employees??

Read the announcement straight from the Kia and Georgia Department of Economic Development and Governor's office:

"At a signing ceremony today in Seoul, Governor Sonny Perdue and Kia President and CEO E.S. Chung announced that Kia Motors Corporation will build an automotive assembly plant in the city of West Point, Georgia, creating more than 2,800 jobs at the plant and making a $1.2 billion economic investment in the state. The business deal includes a commitment from five supplier companies to locate in Georgia, bringing an additional 2,600 jobs for Georgians."

I believe that totals 5,400 jobs not 2,000.

But, hey why let the facts get in the way of a good post (again!), right??

As for your position that the plant is going to hire out of work UAW folks, sorry wrong again....it's a non-union plant and I assure you the last thing they want is a union mentality there. Those jobs will be filled by new employees undergoing a very extensive training program.

That's the problem with the anti-TDK bloggers positions, you know, overestimate a number here, underestimate one there - no problem, mon, as long as it supports my position, right?

You are right on one thing - the fast track widening of Hwy 74 south from Hwy 54 but that's what I was referring to and exactly what needs to be done - make it go from a two lane road to a four lane road where TDK intersects with 74! And again, regardless of what you are saying about the shortfall, the money has been committed so the widening will take place.

There are other points in your post I could rebut but getting into a spitting contest over this issue is getting old.

Look, as my granddaddy always told me, "the truth is somewhere in the middle". TDK will not he Armegeddon as the anti-TDK folks say nor will it be nirvana as the pro-folks say. There will be both good and bad as a result of it depending on your station in life.

My point in all of this is the hysteria coming out of you anti-TDK folks is just flat unreal. Again, as I said in an earlier post, all of these same dire predictions were made about Target and how we would never get in and out of the shopping center. Look at that situation....you can't tell any difference in the traffic. That's why we have professional traffic engineers to help alleviate some of the concerns you raise.

Look the road is coming...development is coming....people are coming....you aren't going to stop it so go do something constructive....plant a tree, be a mentor, hug a child, help someone less fortunate than you are, donate blood, visit the infirmed elderly....know what I mean?

Thanks for the correction on Kia. The 2,000 was for “additional jobs.

Just so you know I have no problem with development as long as it’s done well.

Overburdening Hwy.74 is not doing it well. GRTA and the GDOT should have helped to come up with a better plan.

As for rebutting other facts in my post, you’ll have to take that up with the state of Georgia. That’s where they came from.

... THEY ARE IN THE ROAD-BUILDING BUSINESS, OR MORE SPECIFICALLY THE BUSINESS OF MAKING SURE TRAFFIC KEEPS MOVING. What on earth made you think they'd give a rats behind about the way Hwy. 74 north is developing? If you were paying any attention when the city was being sued over the Kedron Village / Target expansion 2-3 years ago, you'd know that one of the main concerns to all sides was convincing the DOT to allow additional curb cuts and traffic lights off Hwy. 74. They didn't even want to put one at Georgian Park! On the flip side, city planners approached DOT officials and asked for their input on designs for the Hwy. 54 West widening project ... the city and state project manager teamed to come up with the "look" that's nearing completion now. Otherwise, the state was ready to build a road pretty much like every other four-lane in the area. So yes, the DOT can be engaged in the development process, but they sure aren't supposed to initiate it (and besides ... look at their dismal track record for building "developmental highways")

I don’t care how 74, or anything else, gets developed as long as roads aren’t turned into a parking lots and public safety isn’t shelved.

In this case GTOT, GRTA and the ARC should have considered what the impact was going to be on 74 north and made the appropriate decisions. They had no problem imposing a laundry list of “improvements” to several intersections in PTC.

Why wasn’t Fulton County provided a list of improvements? The GDOT’s own numbers indicated that the traffic level on 74 north was going to double. Fulton County has been raping the north end of 74 and what improvements have they been forced to make?

Why didn’t GDOT require improvements on Fisher road to as a means to alleviate some of the congestion?

McIntosh Trail is going to widened to four lanes, 74 is going to be widened to 6 lanes at the TDK intersection and TDK is going to be two lanes. Greg Dunn brought that up at the Sept. 12th meeting and most of the room looked like dear in headlights.

It seems that the state governing bodies looked at what could be done for only a few 10’s of millions of dollars and then said, “oh well it won’t be any worse that some other areas in metro Atlanta”.

Excerpt of an article in the AJC

Of particular concern for Peachtree City are several stipulations in GRTA's approval of the Senoia development that would affect the city, Rast said.

The authority is requiring intersection improvements at Rockaway Road at Holly Grove Road, Ga. 54 at Ga. 74, Ga. 74 at TDK Boulevard and the extension of TDK Boulevard in Peachtree City to intersect with McIntosh Trail in Coweta.

Furthermore, Rast said, GRTA's specifications for intersection improvements in Peachtree City don't necessarily agree with what the Georgia Department of Transportation already has planned for these roadways.

AJC article

With planning like this I'm amazed I can get out of my driveway.

"Uncontrolled cell growth in the human body is called cancer... uncontrolled growth in our cities is called sprawl, the "cancer" that destroys our social fabric" - famous City Planner Andres Duany.

"Roads designed for the highest traffic volumes are huge, formidable, and physically and socially disruptive."

Andres Duany called the sprawl model of urban planning "The Genetic Blueprint for our own Self Destruction as a Nation."

"The increase in traffic in our area impedes the movement of people and goods in our city. The pollution created by traffic destroys the air we breathe" - City of Alexandria (VA) website

"I am convinced that one of the prime causes of urban degradation is the practice of encouraging transport modes that physically destroy or isolate neighborhoods from each other. I live in the midst of a net of immensely-wide freeways and high-speed arterials that all too often form literal walls, with fewer gates in them than some medieval towns, and which effectively separate neighborhoods from each other and from their commercial areas" - - City Planner Richard Risemberg

Because all of these quotes are in favor of "new urbanism" which also means much higher density than suburbia. The idea of new urbanism development where people live/work very close to home is something that most in Fayette County seemingly hate. They want no-density, no-growth and zoning of one house per 3 acres or so. It's the exact opposite of combating "sprawl." Live in one city and drive 30 miles to another city is sprawl and traffic congestion just waiting to happen.

NUK

Your quotes from Duany, "Roads designed for the highest traffic volumes are huge, formidable, and physically and socially disruptive" and Risemberg about "immensely-wide freeways and high-speed arterials that all too often form literal walls, with fewer gates in them than some medieval towns, and which effectively separate neighborhoods from each other and from their commercial areas" actually support TDK. Without the extension, that is exactly what highway 54 will need to be to move all the east-west traffic that is coming, with or without TDK.

Is TDK going to make life perfect? Absolutely not. But the growth is coming unless we buy up all the undeveloped land in Fayette and Coweta and make it permanent greenspace. Sticking our heads in the sand and saying to keep all the traffic on 54 is going to make it much, much worse.

Is like comparing Old Faithful to a garden hose. Yes, they both shoot a stream of water. Come on BorntoBuild, tell us your economic interest in Coweta County or exlain why getting smothered in thousands of cars on Highway 74 (and all over our small city) is such a good thing. What is your occupation? Elected PTC official, real estate agent, or building material supplier?

If you like traffic that much, I suggest Gwinnett County.

Home prices: 1st drop in 11 years

CNN Money.com

Yes, another 3,000+ new homes is just what we need right now.

Or should I call you "borntobuild"? Quite simply, TDK is only supported by those that believe they will make $$$ from it, and this is a minority of PTC citizens. TDK is a classic example of something that will benefit a few to the detriment of the many. That benefit for some will be measure in the millions, hence the reason why these interests focused on our (otherwise) insignificant small town elections.

My 50,000 number includes the rest of the future developments. There are many more coming down this highway, not just the City of McIntosh. Eastern Coweta will resemble the 400 corridor in terms of development in 2 decades. Atlanta is booming, and this is an area waiting to explode. PTC should not open the door to this traffic nightmare. Let Line Creek continue to serve as a protective buffer, and Coweta will build up its own access corridors to I-85.

Crosstown Road to Ebenezer will become a major highway with tens of thousands of vehicles per day. All neighborhoods that access Crosstown will live along a major, noisy, 4 lane highway (maybe with a 5th chicken lane in the middle). Stop lights will be highly sought after by businesses of Crosstown Ct, and residents of Village Park, Brookfield, Glen Carin, Chestnut Field, Treillage, The Terraces, Rockspray, The Summit, Robinson Bend Estates, etc. Huge battles are coming for the residents in these areas. Serious wrecks are looming for your teenagers and youngsters learning to drive.

Highway 74 will eventually look like stop-and-go rush-hour Tara Blvd. Dividend Drive and Paschall road wil be a favorite cut through in the AM and PM rush hours for thousands of residents of the City of McIntosh. Planterra will get lots of cut through traffic, with thousands each morning and afternoon trying to get to 74 via the completed MacDuff Parkway, (while avoiding the nightmare 74-54 intersection). Huddleston Road will also be a favorite, with cars stacking for blocks.

Peachtree Parkway will become a highway, as will Robinson Road. Mcintosh Trail, Windgate, Bridlepath, Clydesdale,Hip Pocket, Willowbend...we all get to enjoy the thousands of cars looking for short cuts to 54 and then 74. What fun is coming!! Battle after battel for speed humps and traffic calming measures, neighborhood versus neighborhood fights are coming (a speed bump program merely moves cars to other streets), fatalities of joggers, bikers, and golf carts.

WAKE UP PTC RESIDENTS!!

Crosstown and Ebenezer a 5 lane highway??? LOL. That's hilarious.
Please explain exactly WHY this would be? Oh, people in Fayetteville wanting to go to Newnan's Pavillion instead of their own and vice-versa? Uh, I don't think so. People in Newnan are NOT commuting to Fayettevilee to work and the same is true of Fayetteville residents.

How many people bought in PTC when build-out was set for around 80K? I'm guessing none of the ignorant I read here did because people wouldn't be having a heart attack and doomsday proclamations(that are ridiuclous, except for humor value) over a few thousand people being added in another county.

NUK

WHY are you trying to distract attention away from the traffic from the new road from Coweta (TDK) onto 74 and then North to I-85? By saying that not many would go to Robinson road across Crosstown is neaningless, isn't it? If Georgia 85 is ever widened from say, Brooks to Fayeteville then we would also have the problem with that from Coweta, but not now. The concern man, is the enormous traffic going by the PTC post office, through the 54/74 intersection and on to I-85, coming from Coweta County.It is NOW a parking lot, nearly. A ROAD IS NEEDED from the eastern Coweta developments to I-85, without going through PTC. Name for me one thing Fayette County citizens (excepting a few builders) would benefit from a TDK extension? You can't. The wool over the eyes is stopping at the hairline, I hope.

Look at the nutty post I was responding to about how Crosstown/Ebenezer is going to be a 5-lane "highway" and so is Robinson Road. All of that because of the TDK extention? Not a chance.

People from Brooks and Coweta will want to go back and forth to Fayetteville and vice-versa if 85 is widened? WHY? What is exactly is in Fayetteville that anyone in Coweta would want to go there for? The pavillion? Newnan is getting their own and also already has every major chain already in Newnan. The Amphitheater? Yeah, that is really going to back-up traffic.

It would be nice if Coweta built another path to I-85 that didn't involve going through PTC, but do they really care? They aren't in Fayette County, remember? What's their incentive? I think they eventually will with the doubling of 154, but until then, people will either go through 74 or drive down to 154.

Even if TDK is blocked one way or the other, there is going to be major development right at the Coweta/PTC line, regardless of roads.
TDK gets all the attention, but the land all around the edge of PTC is owned by developers and they are going to develop it.

NUK

.

PTC residents complain if the "riff-raff" from Coweta come here to shop. Now you complain that they're getting their own shopping centers! You're proud of the fact that many people can't afford to live in PTC, but complain when builders provide nice homes outside of PTC. What will it take to make you people happy? How about if all surrounding towns and counties just messenger their "tribute" payments to City Hall and keep their residents out of PTC? Will that work?

I love PTC, but we sure attract some of the whiniest narrow-minded residents on the planet. Everything is a "total disaster" and the "end of the world." Someone cut down a pine tree? OH MY GOD, life is over! Look, a new house was built! AAARGGH! We don't want no stinkin' shopping and we don't want to drive somewhere like the Pavillion because there are "those people" in Fayetteville.

PTC residents often fail to see the "big picture" of anything, especially when it comes to land-use plans. Lake McIntosh? Gee, that was planned before the first shovel of dirt was moved in the area now known as Planeterra Ridge. Yet, it's a SHOCKER to people now. Same with the railroad tracks over there......it's like those train tracks magically appeared all of a sudden. Duh! Gosh, you think trains might use those tracks sometimes?

Think Coweta County is growing? Yes it is. It is going to keep growing at a rapid rate also, with or without a TDK extention. You can't stop it, either. Is 74 going to continue to be developed? Well gee, I bet so! So, unless PTC buys the city of Tyron, the unincorporated parts of Fulton County plus the city of Fairburn, you can't stop it. Deal with it.

NUK

Notice how someone losing a debate quickly changes the topic. Dear NUKie baby, the topic is TDK, not tree cutting, not Home Depot, not whiney citizens, not former mayors, not Constitutional Law, not Fairburn, not falling sky disasters, etc. THE SUBJECT IS TDK!! You and your profiteer friends don't want this emphasized to the citizens of PTC. As long as we are distracted (and we are - -scouts and middle school football game tonight for me) you and your profiteer buddies can exploit this town until it is a radically changed place, and that elusive charm that was PTC, will be gone with the wind, just as sure Tara as was.

ENOUGH ALREADY "SAVE OUR CITY" with the fear-mongering, class-baiting and baseless predictions that the end is near for your "charming" little town! And all because of a road? I can think of 10 concerns that pose an equal or greater threat to your precious, perfect way of life ... which of course was never more precious or perfect than on the very day YOU arrived.

Like too many PTC residents, unfortunately, you embrace a centrist and elitist view of the "outside" world that paints yourself a victim ... and everybody else the bad guy out to destroy what (in your mind anyway) they can't have. And you accuse NUK of changing the subject while shamelessly employing bad melodrama in an attempt to scare your neighbors into action? Talk about exploitation!

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NEWSBOY ... DELIVERING NOTHING BUT THE FACTS

All the hysteria about TDK ignores 2 basic facts:
1. It will take 10 years to build all those houses and bring all those cars to the roadways - they don't appear overnight, you know.
2. Peachtree City is full of elitists and whiners. The alarmist view that "We are going to be just like Riverdale" has been wheeled out several times a year for the last 25 years and it hasn't happened yet and won't happen this time - because of TDK or anything else. You don't have to look far for REAL TRAFFIC PROBLEMS. Read this morning's paper about 3,000 homes on 12 acres at the corner of Roxboro and Kingsland. Now that's a real problem - not TDK and 3,000 homes on 2,000 acres.
meow

Hello, 7th generation Newsboy. The end is near for another "charming" little town? Sounds like what the people in Fayetteville were saying when they started building PTC !!
Remember that?

And while I don't remember that, I do remember when all the roads they're so worried about getting clogged with Coweta cars were nothing but one-lane dirt trails bisecting hunting preserves and pine forests ... and PT Parkway South dead-ended at McIntosh Trail (i.e. the amphitheater) ... and high schoolers proudly rode the bus to Fayetteville ... and 54/74 was a four-way stop with a flashing light ... and they celebrated the arrival of Hardees ... should I go on? Oh yeah, and Reagan was in the White House.

My, how quickly they act like they own the place ...
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NEWSBOY : DELIVERING NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH

Since you posted your family history, I know your family, and we are related (by marriage)in the 5th generation. I'm sure I know you, and I'm trying to narrow it down. There are SO MANY of you.

Well, Save Our City Don Quixote retuns quickly.

Think about this: what IS the issue with TDK? Is it simply a road? I don't think so. Why are you and some others(who seem to come disguised as empty seats to council meetings) so concerned with this road?

Ahh.. it's traffic congestion! It's more people! Is TDK the only thing on this planet that causes gridlock traffic and new housing and shopping? NO, it isn't! Look there...it's TREES in that forest.

I'm saying you are going to get a big development in East Coweta right up to the edge of PTC whether TDK is extended or not. That's the point.
You can howl about TDK all you want, but I don't think it's going to matter in terms of what Coweta is going to develop. Sure, a TDK extention might make it easier in the short-term for a large-scale development, but it's coming whether TDK happens or not.

There are more people online having seizures over TDK than who bothered to attend a council meeting where that WAS the topic. Hey, looks like the City Council "heard" your silence loud and clear and TDK is going to get done! Congrats! Going off over and over on a discussion forum on the Internet doesn't seem to be the most effective way to communicate with your elected officials. Wow!

As far as your now 2nd accusation that I'm a "TDK profiteer," your claim is asanine. I might as well call you a drooling illiterate with an IQ of 65. Why not? I have no proof of that, but neither do you have a shred that I stand to gain anything from TDK. You have no earthly idea of who I am. You simply can't handle that someone holds a different opinion than you do. Well, that's life, baby!

What was my last great prediction I made? Oh yeah, it was that Steve Brown was going to get stomped in the election. Not just beat, but wiped-out. Since I'm so good, I'll make a couple more:

A)East Coweta in 2 years will look NOTHING like it does now, regardless of TDK.
B)Some people in PTC will be really mad about A.
C)The really mad people won't move away, discover what a land-use plan is or attend council meetings; they'll just keep doing the same old whining and expect different results.

NUK

... the more I LIKE Nuk! He may need reeling in from time to time, but so what? His posts of late demonstrate a firm grip on reality and willingness to look beyond rhetoric to see the big picture. Refreshing for this site, huh? I'd pay attention.
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NEWSBOY : DELIVERING NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH

NuCKlehead, I'm guessing you sell for Remax. I don't see the well bred folks retaining you (too uptight), so I crossed Harry Norman off the list.

Here are your arguments:
Development is coming to the region (true)
Development is coming to Coweta County (true)
PTC citizens can't stop the development in Coweta (true)
Development is a good thing because it increases taxes (true to a point)

Your conclusion from all of this (e.g., PTC citizens should assist the impending development, by making it easier to develop eastern Coweta County by giving them a highway right into the heart of PTC) is totally false.

My hypothesis that you are an economic beneficiary to TDK is based upon the fact that you are obviously not stupid. If you are not stupid, then there is only one logical explanation...you stand to make$$$. BTW, my conclusion is more logical than your conclusion.

... is your "conclusion" that anyone trying to approach this issue with a little common sense and reason MUST be in it for the money!! HOW LOCO ARE YOU?!
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NEWSBOY : DELIVERING NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH

I have never said that PTC should assist with the TDK extention and proposed Coweta development financially. I said it's coming REGARDLESS of TDK. I THINK that probably TDK is a done deal and is going to be extended. It would have been nice 2 years ago, but now, it is probably not going to be so nice as far as PTC is concerned. That's life. Lots of vacant land and Coweta wants that tax base. Housing and commerce is much more appealing and lucrative than farmland.

I have absolutely zippo to do with anything involving real estate, financial services, development, etc. I also don't commute up and down 74, 54, or anything near East Coweta. Not my problem.

PTC is still a great place to live and I think it will continue to be regardless of any of the crap that gets blown so far out of proportion that it's ludicrous. The city isn't going to die regardless of TDK or whatever East Coweta builds. PTC survived 4 years of Steve Brown...it's a resilient city.

NUK

NUK,

I actually agree with your predictions. (little else but, the predictions? yes.)

Those who don't show up . . . those who don't get educated . . . those who don't prioritize paying attention to the activities of their government representatives -- at All levels of government -- have given control over to those who do. It's your choice.

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If you and I are always in agreement, one of us is likely armed and dangerous.

Blather, blather, blather! Don't try to stop any thing that may preserve a way of live. You are peons. Deal with it. Let anybody do anything they have the money to do. Don't plan squat to bridle developers, let them go hog wild. After all they have money and are good people and only have all of our needs in mind, don't they? Nothing can be stopped--not even Islamic wars, or stock manipulating crooks, nor the republican party, nor Boortz, nor Hannity, nor O'Reilly, or Limvurger, and his pills. However, be sure and hang a peon for pills, but not Limvergure! You are a laugh.

Exactly how are we as PTC residents supposed to place *bridles* or anything else on citizens of other counties that have their own rights and goals? Sure, PTC can obstruct a TDK extention, but that has zero effect on the development that is going to occur in Coweta or Hwy 74 outside of PTC.

Like I always say, until the world starts making more land and stops making people, development WILL always happen. People have to live somewhere and a lot of them seem to enjoy areas south of the Airport.
Coweta has a lot of undeveloped land and you had better believe they are going to develop it. Same with Fairburn. All that revenue is what provides the services to the residents and keeps taxes low.

NUK

Dear NUcKle head: Your weird, tortured avatar says more about you than anything you post (by the way, do you suffer from chronic headaches?). Quite simply, Coweta County is about develop very rapidly, and we in PTC cannot stop it - -nor should we - -as people can choose to live in whatever type of town or county they wish. BUT, we in PTC don't have to SUBSIDIZE that development by building them a a highway into our town so that they can use Hwy 74 to go places - -let Coweta County solve its own future problems and pay for it. And, as for you and your developer friends, PTC has a national reputation for a high qulity of life that we all pay extra for in our home prices. You and your friends are TAKING some of that reputation to enrich yourselves by builidng a new town practically in PTC, but y'all don't want to build the City of Mcintosh to similar PTC (low) density standards !! You and your developer friends are literally transferring wealth from us (home values) to your own significant benefit.

I have "developer friends?" I didn't realize that. Who are they? Better yet, who am I? Since you somehow "know" I have developer friends ruining your life(LOL!), you must know who I am. Err...or you are just being totally ignorant once again. I think I'll go with the latter.

I have to say, I am finding it pretty difficult to maintain proper Citizen Forum etiquette when you keep acting like your 12. This is now the 3rd time you have claimed I stand to gain financially from TDK. Despite plenty of evidence in previous posts going back to last year, you don't seem to realize the obvious: I'm not a developer! I could care less about developers! I understand that developers "develop things." They don't pay my bills! Better yet, TDK and East Coweta won't affect me one bit! Or Highway 74. Life is great when you are in control.

You simply cannot debate TDK or anything else apparently without accusing someone of gaining financially or ruining your quality of life. A few here CAN, but you got a long way to go to even get near the arena.

NUK

"TDK and East Coweta won't affect me one bit! Or Highway 74."

There you have it: basically, it will not affect me, so to hell with the rest of you cockroaches in PTC that it WILL AFFECT. Thanks for the community spirit, NUcKlehead. We love you, too.

I especially loved your last line: "Life is great when you are in control."

If the folks in Coweta want to shop here in PTC they are most welcome to do so. They allow me to shop in their county.

What this blog entry has been about, until you showed up, was traffic issues.

Please READ, UNDERSTAND and FOLLOW the conversation before you post again.

Otherwise serious bodily injury may result from operating your computer improperly.

Remember, ALWAYS WEAR EYE PROTECTION.

I agree with Christi...you are a prick. So what
if I didn't post in just the right place for you...
its all tied in here together with all this forever
complaining on and on about TDK, developers,
county officials, Target, stop lights, blah blah blah.

Do you never tire of trying to bully everyone?

Silverlining: It is so refreshing and wonderful to
hear an adult on this board...I get so sick of all
of the so called PTC snoots that lack any class
that they can't even post in an adult manner.
My hat is off to you Madame, your parents should
be proud of your manners...something that most
people on this site lack.

A better way for the Coweta County commuters to get to I-85 rather than clog 74.

Coweta County has 5, count em, 5 ramps for I-85. Fayette County has none, “0”.

Having Coweta County more than doubling the current traffic on 74 north sucks.

I am sure you're not aware of this, but Fayette County has no boundary on I 85!!

See above.

Coweta realizes that 154 needs widening and you can bet that even residents at the very edge of Coweta/PTC would prefer going to 154 than 74. With 54/34 widening complete, that is one very smooth ride down to Thomas Crossroads. Now, they just need to get 154 4-laned.

NUK

Then lets do the 154 thing first. Don't destroy PTC first.

Well, it is up to Coweta gov to make that happen. There isn't a lot a PTC resident can do to convince Coweta and the DOT to hurry up and widen 154.

NUK

Just don't extend TDK and you will see some action on 154!